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Re:A new type of genetic profiling by SolaceQuantum on Thursday November 07, 2019 @04:32PM (#21477529)
"I for one welcome a world of universal access to genetic improvements"

The stuff that's scary is not that there is universally accessible genetic improvements.

The fear is that these improves are not universally accessible.

Re:A new type of genetic profiling by Kalium on Thursday November 07, 2019 @05:33PM (#21478019)
Every one of the above improvements started as not universally accessible. Knowing that they're improvements and available is how we start down the path of making them universally accessible.

Demanding perfection or nothing is perhaps only an ideal approach in scenarios where nothing is, in fact, an acceptable answer. In a world where Tay-Sachs exists, I think that would be an ethically abominable outcome.

Re:A new type of genetic profiling by lisptw102019 on Friday November 08, 2019 @08:29AM (#21481965)
Unfortunately, Ladder-kicking is a pretty common thing in modern society. So is seeking profit at all costs.

In medicine we already see this where companies continually make new drugs that aren't always much better than the old one, but is 'better enough' that their salespeople convince doctors to use that one instead of the old one that has a generic.

What could we do to ensure that from day 1 this is universally accessible? This is VERY dangerous territory, we are talking about potentially bifurcating the human race here.

Re:A new type of genetic profiling by Kalium on Friday November 08, 2019 @11:32AM (#21483803)
I'm taking the position that fewer children dying of avoidable genetic diseases is a strict improvement. I am personally unwilling to insist that extra children should die because we cannot be completely sure that every child on the planet can benefit from the same treatment.

I understand if some take a different perspective on the matter.

Re:A new type of genetic profiling by Gunax on Friday November 08, 2019 @09:37AM (#21482505)
I don't think that's a good example. The medicines are only marginally better than the last, but are sold because they are profitable.

But the whole debate around genetic engineering is that it isn't marginally better. The fear is that it is so supremely powerful it will dwarf all other interventions.

And I don't think ladder kicking is particularly true. Once education was only for the elite. But we have seen it get more and more popular, to the point it's about as universal as possible now.

Re:A new type of genetic profiling by Aperocky on Thursday November 07, 2019 @07:40PM (#21479034)
Of course, name me one thing artificial that is universally accessible? Why should we fear that? How is it different from hating the rich?
Re:A new type of genetic profiling by DiogenesKynikos on Friday November 08, 2019 @02:35AM (#21480552)
K-12 education, and in many developed countries, healthcare and basic housing.
Re:A new type of genetic profiling by bilbo0s on Thursday November 07, 2019 @05:45PM (#21478084)
Even if they were universally accessible, you don't want your kid to be stuck with "last year's model" so to speak.

Today's genetically improved babies could be sub-optimal by the time they hit kindergarten and just plain old obsolete before they go into high school. And the bad news is, I could see the rate of improvement increasing over time. So that material improvements are being made year to year.

Doesn't bode well for when you're going to look for a job at 29 and you have to compete with 28 year olds. Even worse if you're 29 and you have to compete with 25 year olds. And heaven help you if you're 29 and you have to compete with a 20 year old.

Re:A new type of genetic profiling by jlawson on Thursday November 07, 2019 @09:17PM (#21479478)
This is a fixed-pie fallacy.

Someone of mediocre intelligence is not harmed by being in a society of people much smarter than him. On the contrary - he benefits greatly because smarter societies are safer, fairer, and take care of citizens (including the dumb ones).

This is revealed by real-life preferences: People from low IQ countries consistently try very hard to migrate to societies of smarter people. People from low IQ regions try to get into neighborhoods and schools of higher IQ people.

It's like complaining that Einstein existed because my grandpa didn't get to invent relativity. Well, my grandpa was never going to invent relativity. The fact that Einstein existed just means that the rest of us now get to enjoy the positive externalities created by his ability.

It's true that if everyone else is smarter, your relative social status would be lower. But this isn't an argument that scales up, since relative social status is in fixed total supply anyway.

Re:A new type of genetic profiling by Chris2048 on Friday November 08, 2019 @09:16AM (#21482307)
Can you give any examples of "low IQ countries"?
Re:A new type of genetic profiling by jlawson on Saturday November 09, 2019 @03:53AM (#21490436)
Re:A new type of genetic profiling by Aperocky on Thursday November 07, 2019 @07:43PM (#21479053)
That is taking such a utilitarian approach to the extreme. It goes into the reason why people have kids - and it shouldn’t be (although regrettably, it is sometimes) I’m having kids because he/she will be better than everyone else.
Re:A new type of genetic profiling by bradknowles on Thursday November 07, 2019 @06:49PM (#21478684)
Ask yourself what happens with that process when you're 53.
Re:A new type of genetic profiling by BurningFrog on Thursday November 07, 2019 @09:32PM (#21479526)
So... if people getting smarter every year is bad, does that mean people getting dumber every year is good?

Or am I making a mistake by trying to apply logic here?

Re:A new type of genetic profiling by bilbo0s on Friday November 08, 2019 @12:42AM (#21480205)
You are making a mistake.

Mother Nature has no logic. Or rather, if she has logic, it's the logic of simple chromosomal propagation on galactic timescales. She just keeps propagating different combinations and permutations of genes blindly. Then, for instance, if some cataclysmic environmental change happens she ruthlessly culls all of the gene combos that are not able to survive the new environmental reality. Or it could be a new predator. Or a new asteroid strike. Or a new bacteria. Or what have you.

Point is, in the case of our species, she doesn't make people "dumber", or "smarter", or "faster", or "stronger", or "slower", or "darker". She just blindly makes people. Of as many kinds as she possibly can. So that when the change roulette wheel spins, she's already laid bets on every number on the table, black and red alike. Thus giving her the best chance at a win. If I believed in this sort of thing, I might say that Father Time has taught Mother Nature that the shotgun approach is the best survival bet she can make. (And he probably taught that lesson the hard way.)

Contrast that blind propagation strategy against what we would be doing, which is laying odds on certain, but not all, numbers on the hypothetical roulette table. You can kind of see why people might question the wisdom of such a targeted strategy.

Re:A new type of genetic profiling by darawk on Thursday November 07, 2019 @10:21PM (#21479735)
Sure, but what about the history of technology leads you to believe that would be the case? Are smart phones only owned by the super wealthy? Computers? Antibiotics?
Re:A new type of genetic profiling by buboard on Thursday November 07, 2019 @05:17PM (#21477913)
What if they were part of universal healthcare?