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Re:Storm Area 51: The joke that became a ‘possible humanitar... by perl4ever on Saturday September 14, 2019 @09:31PM (#20975009)
If only a few people go, then it isn't a major disaster whatever happens.

If a lot of people go, they will run into difficulty long before they get to the fence with threatening signs. There isn't remotely the infrastructure to support people on a large scale. The roads don't exist, the hotels don't exist, the food and water and gasoline sources don't exist... If a million people decided to go, that doesn't mean they will get there because they can't teleport. And they won't all fail at once in the same spot.

I'm from NY, but I've been to Rachel. No gasoline and total hotel capacity of maybe 15 rooms? I remember seeing a defunct gas station that looked like it had closed in the 1960s.

Re:Storm Area 51: The joke that became a ‘possible humanitar... by fnord77 on Saturday September 14, 2019 @10:39PM (#20975236)
> There isn't remotely the infrastructure to support people on a large scale

This hasn't stopped the Burning Man crowd in BRC

Re:Storm Area 51: The joke that became a ‘possible humanitar... by tbabb on Sunday September 15, 2019 @02:36AM (#20975900)
Burning man has extensive planning and infrastructure, which has been built up over years of adapting to slow growth, and which goes on for months before the event opens.

At burning man, people buy tickets months ahead of time, whose supply is limited, so the number of people in attendance is known. Road markings are put up on the playa to manage the huge volume of traffic entering the city (waiting in the gate line in your vehicle can take multiple hours, sometimes the better part of a day– remember, this is with good organization). Space on the playa for each camp is planned and allotted, and someone shows you to your space. Water trucks continuously spray the streets to keep the dust down.

Burners know what they are responsible for. There is basically not a single piece of litter in the city, because there is a strong and highly unified culture of not-littering and being responsible for your own garbage. Similarly, burners are fully self-reliant for water because there is unified understanding that there is little safety net if you screw up and don't bring enough.

This is a big one: At burning man, thousands of porta-potties are put up and routinely cleaned and pumped multiple times a day. The number of needed toilets is known because of ticket sales, and the ticket sales also pay for the toilets and their servicing.

None of this is true of the coming event, however big or small it is. Experience at burning man makes me more worried about how bad this could be without planning, organization, and a unified culture that strongly emphasizes self-reliance and respect.

Re:Storm Area 51: The joke that became a ‘possible humanitar... by jandrewrogers on Sunday September 15, 2019 @01:39AM (#20975758)
Black Rock and Area 51 are not comparable environments, Black Rock is much more forgiving for the unprepared traveller. I've gone off-roading in both regions extensively. Black Rock is a relatively temperate and populated area for Nevada, albeit rural, and Pershing County has decades of experience dealing with thousands of unprepared people. The region around Area 51 is essentially a bone-dry wasteland with a couple mining camps in the area and nothing else.

The carrying capacity for excess population around Area 51 is all but non-existent, and far smaller than in the region around Black Rock.

Re:Storm Area 51: The joke that became a ‘possible humanitar... by perl4ever on Saturday September 14, 2019 @11:50PM (#20975477)
I don't know first hand, but since it has been consistently tens of thousands of people, it's become really organized, according to what I read. The logistics aren't trivial or spontaneous. The people coming have some idea of how it works, not to mention many of them have a lot of resources.
Re:Storm Area 51: The joke that became a ‘possible humanitar... by ToFab123 on Sunday September 15, 2019 @12:04AM (#20975520)
It wasn't always like that
Re:Storm Area 51: The joke that became a ‘possible humanitar... by bardworx on Saturday September 14, 2019 @10:43PM (#20975244)
But burning man provides the infrastructure. This like burning man but with no food, water, gas, place to stay, and folks possibly shooting at you...not exactly a direct comparison.
Re:Storm Area 51: The joke that became a ‘possible humanitar... by bigiain on Saturday September 14, 2019 @11:14PM (#20975343)
> This like burning man but with no food, water, gas, place to stay,

so just like Burningman?

> and folks possibly shooting at you

Or Burningman back before '99 when people were still allowed to take firearms? (Anyone else remember the Drive By Shooting Range? Drums of avgas, stuffed toys, tracer rounds, and tequila, all from the back of a moving pickup - what could possibly go wrong?)

Re:Storm Area 51: The joke that became a ‘possible humanitar... by DuskStar on Saturday September 14, 2019 @11:20PM (#20975364)
> Anyone else remember the Drive By Shooting Range? Drums of avgas, stuffed toys, tracer rounds, and tequila, all from the back of a moving pickup - what could possibly go wrong?

Oh my god that sounds hilarious. Also hilariously dangerous and irresponsible, but still hilarious...

Re:Storm Area 51: The joke that became a ‘possible humanitar... by bigiain on Saturday September 14, 2019 @11:36PM (#20975427)
It ran for maybe 5 years from memory. 99.999% certain nobody got killed. I only got to play once. It was _amazingly_ stupid fun!
Re:Storm Area 51: The joke that became a ‘possible humanitar... by sneak on Sunday September 15, 2019 @12:27AM (#20975569)
I still quite wonder how it is constitutional for the BLM to ban firearms during Burning Man.
Re:Storm Area 51: The joke that became a ‘possible humanitar... by paggle on Sunday September 15, 2019 @12:59AM (#20975657)
What part of the Constitution would it violate? Is it unconstitutional to ban firearms when boarding a flight? When attending a speech by the President of the United States? When visiting your spouse in jail?
Re:Storm Area 51: The joke that became a ‘possible humanitar... by refurb on Sunday September 15, 2019 @01:07AM (#20975677)
All of those examples have passed the scrutiny of the courts. Just banning firearms in large groups hasn’t.
Re:Storm Area 51: The joke that became a ‘possible humanitar... by paggle on Sunday September 15, 2019 @01:47AM (#20975774)
Well the only way to get court scrutiny is to gain standing and sue them.
Re:Storm Area 51: The joke that became a ‘possible humanitar... by refurb on Sunday September 15, 2019 @08:59PM (#20980365)
You can infer whether it would pass by past cases.
Re:Storm Area 51: The joke that became a ‘possible humanitar... by jazzyjackson on Sunday September 15, 2019 @04:02AM (#20976124)
I rather expect burning man banned it themselves, they get to set the rules for their own event
Re:Storm Area 51: The joke that became a ‘possible humanitar... by sneak on Monday September 16, 2019 @02:28PM (#20987094)
It’s a federal government mandate, as burning man is on federal land administrated by the BLM.
Re:Storm Area 51: The joke that became a ‘possible humanitar... by cnorthwood on Sunday September 15, 2019 @05:27AM (#20976342)
The Constitution limits what the government can do, not private citizens or corporations.
Re:Storm Area 51: The joke that became a ‘possible humanitar... by ThrowawayR2 on Sunday September 15, 2019 @08:34AM (#20976945)
BLM probably refers to the Bureau of Land Management of the U. S. Dept. of the Interior.
Re:Storm Area 51: The joke that became a ‘possible humanitar... by toomuchtodo on Saturday September 14, 2019 @11:02PM (#20975311)
Fyre festival with military intervention.
Re:Storm Area 51: The joke that became a ‘possible humanitar... by disjhshava on Sunday September 15, 2019 @02:05AM (#20975813)
Burning Man doesn't provide any of those things for attendees.
Re:Storm Area 51: The joke that became a ‘possible humanitar... by sb057 on Saturday September 14, 2019 @11:00PM (#20975303)
>that doesn't mean they will get there because they can't teleport.

Only one person needs to get the teleportation device, though!

Re:Storm Area 51: The joke that became a ‘possible humanitar... by ASalazarMX on Sunday September 15, 2019 @03:40PM (#20979092)
But that person needs the confusion in numbers to get away with "freeing" the teleporter. I guess if someone manages to "free" a time machine in the raid, the paradox will sort itself out.
Re:Storm Area 51: The joke that became a ‘possible humanitar... by devoply on Saturday September 14, 2019 @10:25PM (#20975193)
What about off-road vehicles, tents, campers, bringing in the food with them, etc. Though I know a lot of idiots would not prepare and try to just show up and if they did so they would be stuck in a major traffic jam which I guess would only clear up when everyone decided to give up and turned around and went home starting from the last person to arrive.
Re:Storm Area 51: The joke that became a ‘possible humanitar... by bigiain on Saturday September 14, 2019 @11:08PM (#20975327)
So, kinda like Burningman, only without Flume and Paris Hilton?
Re:Storm Area 51: The joke that became a ‘possible humanitar... by perl4ever on Saturday September 14, 2019 @11:54PM (#20975490)
Well, you can speculate on what number of people would try that, and how many could succeed. It's not hard to go there if nobody else does.
Re:Storm Area 51: The joke that became a ‘possible humanitar... by goodcanadian on Sunday September 15, 2019 @02:12AM (#20975827)
There isn't remotely the infrastructure to support people on a large scale.

That is precisely where the potential humanitarian disaster comes from. If large numbers of people show up without the infrastructure to support them, things could go very wrong.

Re:Storm Area 51: The joke that became a ‘possible humanitar... by Mirioron on Sunday September 15, 2019 @03:01AM (#20975966)
The point the parent is trying to make is that a large amount of people won't be able to just suddenly show up. The poor infrastructure means that the closer people get gradually the more people fail. They won't all fail at once.
Re:Storm Area 51: The joke that became a ‘possible humanitar... by JoeAltmaier on Sunday September 15, 2019 @08:41AM (#20976961)
So then what? They'll all be congested on a blacktop road somewhere in the middle of the desert, running out of fuel and water? That sounds like a disaster.
Re:Storm Area 51: The joke that became a ‘possible humanitar... by slyall on Sunday September 15, 2019 @04:14AM (#20976156)
I'd estimate a worst case would be:

  * 20,000 people show up
  * 2,000 of those try to get though the gates/fence
  * Half of those are in vehicles, some offroad
  * Some people are armed
  * Shots are fired as vehicles refuse to stop
  * Dozens end up dead, many more injured, hundreds arrested
Re:Storm Area 51: The joke that became a ‘possible humanitar... by thunderrabbit on Sunday September 15, 2019 @08:29AM (#20976934)
/u/remindme 2 weeks

Aww man, wrong site.

Re:Storm Area 51: The joke that became a ‘possible humanitar... by craftyguy on Sunday September 15, 2019 @01:09PM (#20978221)
> If a lot of people go, they will run into difficulty long before they get to the fence with threatening signs

This is literally what the article (which you read, right?) is about...

Re:Storm Area 51: The joke that became a ‘possible humanitar... by Fjolsvith on Sunday September 15, 2019 @01:57PM (#20978495)
This sounds so much like the invasion from central America.