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Re:I’ve Picked My Job over My Kids by rayiner on Saturday June 29, 2019 @07:46PM (#20315546)
Yet they’re in college. Their parents having prioritized work over their kids undoubtedly will allow those kids to live an immensely better life than they would have otherwise. There’s millions of people in the world that would trade places with them in a heartbeat.

One of my fears is that my kids will learn these bad American ideas from media. I saw my daughter watching a Disney show (Bunk’d), where a high achieving Asian girl was telling her parents they “pushed her too hard.” No wonder China is eating our lunch.

Re:I’ve Picked My Job over My Kids by barry-cotter on Sunday June 30, 2019 @12:16AM (#20316295)
Having lived in China for seven years I see no sign that the Chinese have eaten, are eating, or are going to eat America’s lunch. Growth at the technological frontier is about what the best are doing and diffuses from there. I am unaware of any academic field or major industry where the US is not in the top three, hardly surprising given its 5% of global population and 25% of global economic activity. As long as the US has enough strivers and hard workers it can afford plenty of slackers.

The only way for the US’ relative position not to decline with China’s rise involve megadeaths, just as after WWII it’s relative power could only decline.

Re:I’ve Picked My Job over My Kids by taesko on Sunday June 30, 2019 @06:07AM (#20317395)
> As long as the US has enough strivers and hard workers it can afford plenty of slackers.

That's an uncomfortable idea - growth of a nation being dependent on a few people working their ass off. Like sacrificial lambs. Though almost all of these people probably do it willingly.

Re:I’ve Picked My Job over My Kids by lonelappde on Sunday June 30, 2019 @10:46AM (#20318468)
That's life. Life is incredibly expensive, and people who enjoy it are getting from the hard work and suffering of animals and other people and themselves. And the suffering of others scales far better then self-sacrificing.
Re:I’ve Picked My Job over My Kids by ulisesrmzroche on Sunday June 30, 2019 @09:08AM (#20317996)
What’s so uncomfortable about it? It’s never been any different.
Re:I’ve Picked My Job over My Kids by pergadad on Sunday June 30, 2019 @04:03AM (#20316996)
Decline doesn't have to be rapid.
Re:I’ve Picked My Job over My Kids by BasDirks on Sunday June 30, 2019 @05:56AM (#20317353)
What signs of a slow decline do you identify?
Re:I’ve Picked My Job over My Kids by technothrasher on Sunday June 30, 2019 @08:25AM (#20317831)
One of my fears is that my kids will learn these bad American ideas from media.

I watched my poor Sikh friend exasperated with his two young daughters who desperately wanted a Christmas tree like all the other kids and bugged him endlessly about it. He lost. It was pretty funny. They've both now grown into fine young women who are proud of their Sikh religion, so no harm done.

Re:I’ve Picked My Job over My Kids by harryh on Saturday June 29, 2019 @07:48PM (#20315558)
Ironically, no matter how attentive of a parent you are, your daughter is in fact likely to pick up ideas like that from media, her friends, and the surrounding culture. Alas!
Re:I’ve Picked My Job over My Kids by L_Rahman on Sunday June 30, 2019 @12:13PM (#20318916)
This is not black and white. If I recall correctly from other interactions we've had on Hacker News, we're both Bangladeshi-American so please know I'm looking at this with a similar lens.

My parents absolutely should have emphasized academics and my need to go to college to break out of the poverty trap my family was in. But they did that in violent and traumatic ways. They did that by using guilt and shame and burden as the primary engine to drive me to act. They are not alone in this. Friends of Asian-American heritage (East and South Asia) tell me their parents did the same.

Those things work when you're fighting for survival and then turn out to be incredibly harmful when you're not. It's taken me years of work and will take years more to undo that damage.

I understand your sensitivity to your daughter's situation. If you live in upper middle class America, and I suspect you do, your daughter is observing a deeply unnatural form of childhood. But there is a middle ground between squeezing performance out of young brains and being coddled into doing nothing. I hope for both of your sakes you look for it.

Re:I’ve Picked My Job over My Kids by wishinghand on Saturday June 29, 2019 @08:13PM (#20315644)
> No wonder China is eating our lunch!

Slave like conditions can do that to a more moderate work-life balance culture.

Re:I’ve Picked My Job over My Kids by rayiner on Saturday June 29, 2019 @11:28PM (#20316158)
There is lot of room between “slave like conditions” and the modern American trend of decadent children and adolescents that live in a state of extended infancy well into their 20s. From 1948 to 2000, the teenage labor force participation rate was 45-55%. Since 2000 it has dropped dramatically, to just 35% last year.
Re:I’ve Picked My Job over My Kids by barry-cotter on Sunday June 30, 2019 @12:21AM (#20316316)
“Extended infancy”? Really? Protracted adolescence sure, a giant pointless distraction fine, a diversion from things you value, ok, but infancy? Infants and children do not take time off to find themselves, travel, take a career break or whatever in particular you don’t value about this American (and Western) cultural tendency.

If you don’t want your children to do this what are you going to do about it? Help them get real jobs without going to college? Accelerate their paths into professional jobs by accelerating their academic careers? Because if you don’t do something out of the ordinary you’re going to get pretty much the same results as other people in your position.

Re:I’ve Picked My Job over My Kids by Spooky23 on Sunday June 30, 2019 @09:42AM (#20318151)
With good reason... the labor force is such that employers don’t want teenagers and the strings attached to them (ie work hour limits, etc). They prefer to put adults on call.
Re:I’ve Picked My Job over My Kids by wolco on Sunday June 30, 2019 @02:34AM (#20316711)
10% drop in the teenage smoking.. not needing to save for buying music / movies.

Kids need less money these days and are more focused on education vs work experience.

Re:I’ve Picked My Job over My Kids by nitrogen on Sunday June 30, 2019 @05:15AM (#20317215)
The jobs kids used to work are also more and more essential for adults to make a living.
Re:I’ve Picked My Job over My Kids by watwut on Sunday June 30, 2019 @09:11AM (#20318014)
> I saw my daughter watching a Disney show (Bunk’d), where a high achieving Asian girl was telling her parents they “pushed her too hard.” No wonder China is eating our lunch.

The thing is, such a phenomenon exists. And kids pushed too hard may grow resentful or plain reject parents ideas and rebel. Not all them grow super succesfull. Plenty just grow feeling like failures.

It is possible to push children just right, of course. But there is such a thing as too much and those adults then complain (that is how I know).

Re:I’ve Picked My Job over My Kids by madengr on Sunday June 30, 2019 @09:24AM (#20318067)
I tell my kids I’m striving to be the Chinese Tiger Dad, when I pester them to practice the cello (daughter) and viola (son).
Re:I’ve Picked My Job over My Kids by koolba on Sunday June 30, 2019 @02:07AM (#20316642)
All I can say is amen brother!
Re:I’ve Picked My Job over My Kids by lonelappde on Sunday June 30, 2019 @10:44AM (#20318453)
Your argument is getting perilously close to "good things aren't good because some people survive without them."

China is eating our lunch? Excuse me?

Re:I’ve Picked My Job over My Kids by rayiner on Sunday June 30, 2019 @01:40PM (#20319391)
I think birthday celebrations teach kids to be self-centered, but that’s neither here nor there. (And I lost that battle with my wife as to my own kid anyway.)

But the folks criticizing the article aren’t just asserting that these things are good. They’re claiming that not having these things is so damaging that a woman who prioritizes her career over attending birthday parties and school events is a bad mother. But many children grow up to be perfectly well adjusted despite not having those things. That is evidence of the fact that, even if those things are “good,” they’re not “essential.”

Re:I’ve Picked My Job over My Kids by permatech on Sunday June 30, 2019 @03:38AM (#20316916)
And yet so many Chinese continue to come to the US, it’s almost as if this bad ideas actually make a happier society
Re:I’ve Picked My Job over My Kids by dang on Sunday June 30, 2019 @02:11PM (#20319548)
Please don't take threads further into generic flamewar.
Re:I’ve Picked My Job over My Kids by permatech on Sunday June 30, 2019 @06:56PM (#20321094)
Pointing out that Chinese leave their own country for the west as soon as they have the means to do so is a generic flame?