0.4% is an extremely steep price for a company like mine doing over $2.5m in annual turnover (saas) which has a very low fraud rate. I actually think currently we pay less than that by doing nothing (meaning letting Paypal handle it, and losing every case). However I'd gladly pay a few thousands per year for it, or be able to pay it on selected transactions (only US for instance).

Then this offering isn't cost effective for you and you can ignore it. I'm not sure I understand why this thread is full of people complaining it doesn't solve a problem this solution isn't targeting, or, like you, saying this costs more than simply accepting your low chargeback rate. When I rent a car, I decline the offer for me being able to return the car without gas because for me, it's trivial and cheaper for me to refill the car. I don't complain that the price should be lower, or that they should instead be offering sunroofs on more cars.

And I'm the opposite. I return the car empty every time, because the cost of "finding a gas station" when you're in a hurry to catch a flight isn't worth the extra $X they charge for the service to fill it. Choices are great!

It’s called product feedback. You are also complaining about the poster’s complaining, which is essentially the same thing.

> However I'd gladly pay a few thousands per year for it

0.4% on $2.5m is $10k a year. I realize "ten" is a bit more than "a few", but is Stripe's price point materially that far off from where you want it to be?

Said another way, I imagine that there are at least a few problems smaller than chargeback protection at your company that you throw $10k or more at just to make that problem go away... right? If so, this makes their price somewhere between reasonable to good.

I am really curious about your thinking on their price as it relates to other expenses in your company. Could you expand on that?

What he's saying is that currently doing nothing costs him less than what paying 0.4% to 'insure' transactions would, so why bother with insurance?

Ultimately established companies know how much chargebacks cost them and thus whether this product is worth it (= costs less).

Another thing to take into account is that if you're not using Stripe Checkout now, you will have to migrate to it, and since Dynamic 3DS will be used to filter and "secure" potential fraud, you will probably see a decrease in conversion rate.

welp I'm ashamed, my mental math was off by one zero, and I thought I was going to pay 100k/year. At 10k I'll buy without thinking about it.

Use a separate (insured) merchant account for the dodgy transactions?

you should look into chargehound[chargehound.com], i think they would work for you.

Their cost estimator estimates 30 minutes preparing a chargeback dispute. I do them when they come in and it never takes even 5 minutes.

Hey there, founder of Chargehound here, it's a slider so you can adjust it to 5 mins if you want.

Many companies do take up to 30 minutes especially if they are compiling a comprehensive portfolio (if the dispute is for thousands of dollars) and are outsourcing the representment.

As an end user, how can I tell the modal dialog is actually my bank?

It looks trivial for the vendor to man in the middle attack.

I’d take my business elsewhere if presented with a UI from some random e-commerce site asking for extra personal information.

3D secure payments in Europe have been a standard for years - being presented with additional verification steps for online purchases.

Attacker cannot know who you bank with. Plus, most of the time the confirmation screens are something like confirming 2nd/Xth characters of your password/date of birth.

I bank with Monzo and they send a push notification to my phone with an "Approve" button. No way to fake that.

> confirming 2nd/Xth characters

That is somehow significantly less reassuring than not having 3D Secure payments in the first place.

Before this, if a customer opened a dispute and you won, you (the business owner) didn't have to pay any dispute fees without having to pay for anything extra. It was just a part of the standard Stripe offering.

You even wrote this on your site's documentation[0]. Here's what it says as of right now:

> There is a dispute resolution process through which you can respond and submit evidence to make your case that the payment was valid. If the dispute is found in your favor, the disputed amount and fee is returned back to you.

If we don't opt into this new fraud protection service, are all dispute fees still waived if the business wins the case?

[0]: https://stripe.com/docs/disputes

I work at Stripe. That’s right! Nothing changes in the way we handle disputes for businesses that are not on Chargeback Protection. Your dispute fees are still waived if you win the dispute.

I'm curious if there is a way we could avoid the cost all together if we don't need the money deposited in our bank accounts right away?

I work for a non-profit & we had some very large donations come in online through Stripe. Someone did a typo donated $10,000. I'm sure we could set some max limit & say no donations larger than $X but it was common to have $1,000 donations. Even with a $1,000 donations the fee gets expensive.

In our case, we don't need those funds immediately. We would much rather not have access to them for a month & not have to worry about a request for the funds to be refunded.

Will Stripe still take efforts to prevent fraudulent transactions for customers who don't pay an extra 0.4% for it?

I work at Stripe. Yes, absolutely. We’re continuing to invest in Stripe Radar and our machine learning fraud prevention (the team is doubling by the end of the year!). Radar is included at no additional cost in our standard payments processing pricing (2.9% + 30 cents in the US, with similar pricing elsewhere).

Completely unrelated, but please add an alternative fee structure more appropriate for microtransactions. Stripe has a vast amount of useful features from which my business could benefit, but its cost is prohibitive as all our transactions are for low amounts (1$ or less), which make your 30cent fee a 30% of the total.

We are forced to use credit cards directly and Paypal, as both offer a much lower fixed fee (sometimes 0) in exchange for higher %.

Great product! Will this be rolling out in Hong Kong at some point in the future?

(PM on Chargeback Protection here.) We’d like to extend Chargeback Protection to all Stripe countries eventually. Stay tuned!

Any ETA on when chargeback protection will be available for Stripe.js?

No ETA just yet, but we are exploring ways to bring Chargeback Protection to other integration options!