Correct:

https://nest.com/whats-happening/#im-a-works-with-nest-devel...

Another reminder to never buy a "smart" device. At the end of the day they are pretty dumb.

Once again HomeKit's design proves to be prescient.

https://www.theverge.com/2017/8/3/16083996/internet-of-shit-...

Hrm. How so? HomeKit does not allow third party devs to write apps to control HomeKit devices, AFAICT. So they never added the capability that Google is removing. People can still develop devices that are triggered by Nest and Google Home. They just can no longer write apps that themselves trigger or modify Nest devices.

Or are you saying it's prescient because Apple saw that such capabilities were not economically viable in the long run, and so it was prescient of them to never develop the functionality in the first place?

HomeKit doesn't require an internet connection for smart home devices to work, it doesn't require you to use the smart home maker's garbage apps or sign up for accounts with them, it gives away for free features that smart home makers try to put behind subscription paywalls, and most importantly it was designed to be secure.

I haven’t tested this, but I believe you could use Homebridge to create a virtual “button” that got “pushed” when you hit some API endpoint, then configure HomeKit to change something when the button gets pressed.

HomeBridge can control HomeKit accessories just fine.

Can you show an example of HomeBridge controlling an HomeKit accessory? The description of the project says the opposite: it allows the control of non-HomeKit accessories from HomeKit.

HomeKit is not open and requires Apple devices.

That is not true. The HomeKit protocol is documented. There are at least a few open source projects that implement it both as accessories and hubs. Home Bridge being the best known one.

If all the accessory vendors were to go under and Apple were to stop supporting HomeKit tomorrow, HomeKit accessories and hubs would still operate just fine and alternatives could be created. Even using Alexa or Google Nest for voice control.

Being documented is not enough. Implementing a commercial device requires including an Authentication component (before it used to be an actual chip, now it seems it can be done in software), and that can be used to prevent devices from speaking to alternative control apps.

From what I can tell, Homebridge implements Homekit as a device, receiving commands. But can anyone build an app or device to send commands, outside of iOS?

The fact that I can't find an Homekit control app for Android strongly indicates this is not possible.

Being fully documented means anything can work in any way.

> Being fully documented means anything can work in any way.

A protocol being fully documented does not mean you can get a device you cannot control (like an Homekit lightbulb) to connect to your server instead of the manufacturer's. If requests are signed and/or encrypted, knowing the protocol won't help if you don't have the keys. See also Tivoization.

> For example, search the web for ‘homebridge alexa’

I had found it. I don't think you realize that there's no Homekit there at all.

The point of Homebridge is to translate from a Homekit-speaking control app/assistant to a non-Homekit-enabled device:

https://blog.theodo.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/08/workflow....

But when you use homebridge-alexa, you're replacing that first link with another protocol (specifically, MQTT+JSON, which is what it uses to connect to https://www.homebridge.ca/).

So you've actually removed all Homekit parts from your smart home system!

Samsung's SmartThings seems to be pretty similar. Not sure about it's security though.

I have Wemo smart plugs that I have plugged in all sorts of stuff like Heater, Lamps, and TV, etc connected to my Google Home and Home Mini. And I'd advise anyone to think twice before buying smart plugs or smart devices. There are so many bugs creating so many complications that I feel they are not worth using. You'd need to reconnect them with WEMO app time and again, restart these frequently if they just stop working and even you would not know what to do with them when a failed firmware upgrade will make your smart plug useless!

The sad thing is it's not rocket science.

It's just terrible, barely working, shoehorned in buggy drivers, "shipped as soon as it can appear functional" code.

You could take a microcontroller, write something simple, and have something that worked to a few 9s.

Instead, IoT vendors spend their time optimizing their data collection and monetization platforms.

"You had one job..." would be a good epitaph for the entire industry.

s/a few nines/more nines than the cloud/

Not really, my power from PG&E in the Bay Area has fewer nines than even the cheapest cloud providers.

> And I'd advise anyone to think twice before buying smart plugs or smart devices.

Not all smart devices are created alike. Research your purchases.

So far the one I’ve been most happy with is IKEA Trådfri.

It costs roughly half of the comparable Phillips hue offering, but still delivers on any aspect I care about.

Works 100% locally, uses standard Zigbee (non-WiFi) networking. No cloud required.

Supports HomeKit, Alexa, google assistant, not to mention Home Assistant.

More importantly, it supports other vendor’s Zigbee devices (like Hue) and supports working with other Zigbee controllers than IKEA’s own.

Also certified non-shit by kernel-hacker Matthew Garret[1].

Nobody can shut me out of this purchase. This is actually my hardware.

[1] https://mjg59.dreamwidth.org/47803.html

I have also voted with my money for IKEA Trådfri and am quite happy with it. Light bulbs, motion sensors, remote controls. Everything connected to zigbee coordinator and controlled with simple node red flows. And good thing is that list of supported devices is longer than any other single vendor with option to expand it by your self.

Baby starts moving in bedroom, light bulb flashes in kitchen.

Sonos stopped supporting remote control, no problem, map IKEA remote controller to start/stop Sonos playback.

https://nodered.org

https://www.zigbee2mqtt.io

https://www.zigbee2mqtt.io/information/supported_devices.htm...

https://www.ikea.com/gb/en/products/lighting/smart-lighting/

I have Trådfri and Philips Hue. Trådfri is good, but I prefer my Hue devices. They are even better quality.

i’m also pretty happy with my ikea trådfri bulbs and outlets. works with homekit via the trådfri hub (which i got for half price in the as-is section) so i can create scenes and automations easily. it’s still early and limited, and new features are slow to come by, but i’m not trying to do anything fancy yet anyway.

All I can say is if like me you'd bought Energenie MiHomes, you'd have spent half as much working out that you need to think twice becase there are so many bugs that make them not worth using... I seldom hear success stories from us early adopters with smarthome things.

I also have two Nests. Stringify has now shut down (and was buggy/difficult to use), and IFTTT is now losing access to Nest it seems, so I guess that's a real knockback of at least several years for smarthome.

Even when it was all in theory working, the most simple thing was not actually possible - Nest shows you humidity, so when humidity is over 60%, turn on the dehumidifier (I have one upstairs, one downstairs). Such a simple task coudln't be achieved because of about individual problems, and this to me puts the date of solving it back quite a way.

If I'm reading this right, the Wemo plugs should still work? The part of the program that's ending is that Nest devices can no longer be controlled by third party apps. Devices that are controlled by Nest should still be controlled by Nest. At least, unless I have vastly misunderstood the FAQ?

I bought a WeMo plug and was quite shocked to discover that there is no form of security or authentication. Anyone using the same network that your WeMo devices are using can control them using the WeMo mobile app and crucially keep controlling them once they have left your network via the Belkin cloud. They are effectively proving an open door to your network that requires you to trust Belkin to keep secure.

Edit: They do support UPnP, but still they are wide open to attack.

Wemo’s plugs support other protocols too, don’t they? Could you bridge one of those to what you need?

I have Wemo smart plugs connected to AppleHome and have no issues.

Adding to this, I have them setup with Google Assistant, and Alexa. No issues with Assistant, and rare issues with Alexa.

Not saying the OP isn't having issues, but there might be a sample bias when reading the comments.

Don't buy electronic devices not supporting open standards or technologies.

There are many wonderful devices from China that have hackable APIs that don't need to phone home to Google to work. They're also much cheaper and more OSS friendly.

I’m always worried about:

- security

- support

- safety

With those devices. Don’t get me wrong, I love AliExpress - but I’d be worried about anything running at mains voltage, especially when I’m away from home.

Most of what I purchase on that front is from Amazon. Excepting a few wifi switches (which are UL listed), everything runs on 12v.

Unless you roll your own. But then we’re in the bad old days of home automation just for tinkerers...

I have lost all hope that it will ever be otherwise. It's quite straightforward to build smart home devices for youself that are reliable and don't depend on the whims of some cloud or firmware vendor, but the minute you try to form a company that sells them you'll be required to generate a continuing revenue stream which means shitting on your customers in one way or the other.

Is this true? I’ve used open source printers from Lulzbot and others, and I haven’t had this experience. I think the moral of the story is to not put stuff on some closed platform in the cloud, not that you shouldn’t use company-provided hardware.

I think his point was that it is hard to keep a company going making just the hardware. The margins are low, and customers only have to pay you once, to get the hardware.

It is hard to make a lasting business off that, which is why everyone wants to do subscription services.

It used to be the only way to make business in not so long past. People made money selling products just fine.

Maybe it's because people trying to get rich quick playing the VC lottery are sucking the oxygen out for people who want to just do a honest to God, "payment in exchange for providing value" type of business.

Yes, I think it's the VC mindset. It's "grow fast and exit quick" rather than "build a sustainable business."

I honestly have give it quite a bit of thought as to what it would take to start an open source hardware company. Everything has a user accessable API and the option to use their own firmware if they want.

The more important thing than hack-ability is that the product is rock solid.

That implies stuff like "there is one way to do it", "95+% branch coverage in unit tests", and "100,000-1M hours of automated stress testing of real hardware before shipping a new board rev."

and any cloud services would be AGPL

I realize this is Google's moment of "Plays for Sure".