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Re:Epic Games Is Acquiring Psyonix by Wowfunhappy on Wednesday May 01, 2019 @08:13PM (#19803103)
> There is value in Steam having competition, but that value diminishes as soon as someone comes along and competes for games instead of users.

Content platforms always compete on availability of content. Steam did the exact same thing early on with Half Life. Look at what's happening in the streaming video space. Look at console gaming.

Ultimately, people aren't making Steam accounts because of the Steam workshop or Steam forums or Steam chat or what have you—they're making Steam accounts because there's a game on Steam that they want to play.

If Epic's store had better features but the same games, existing Steam users would still continue to use Steam, because that's where their existing game libraries are. The only way Epic could compete on features alone is if it were possible to migrate Steam purchases to the Epic Store. Since Valve will never let that happen, Epic has to entice users with exclusive games.

And that could be great for everyone—if it caused games to be made that would otherwise never get developed. Consider how much great content the video streaming wars have produced. As annoying as it is to switch between subscriptions, I'd say TV viewers are winning right now.

The problem, of course, is that Epic isn't developing original content—they're paying for existing content to be removed from Steam. My great hope is that this will change in time. Original games take several years to develop, so if any are under way, we wouldn't have heard about them yet. In the meantime, we're getting PC ports of Journey and Detroit, so that's pretty neat!

Re:Epic Games Is Acquiring Psyonix by vaer-k on Wednesday May 01, 2019 @10:50PM (#19804166)
> Ultimately, people aren't making Steam accounts because of the Steam workshop or Steam forums or Steam chat or what have you—they're making Steam accounts because there's a game on Steam that they want to play.

This is just false. Steam has evolved beyond just a marketplace, and I go there because I enjoy the tools they provide. From VR, to family sharing, home streaming, and more.

Re:Epic Games Is Acquiring Psyonix by Wowfunhappy on Wednesday May 01, 2019 @11:18PM (#19804331)
Imagine an alternate universe where the Steam client had feature parity with our universe's Epic client, and Epic's client had feature parity with our universe's Steam client. Do you think users would abandon their Steam libraries for the Epic Store, in order to have home streaming?

What's relevant to this discussion isn't what features you like about Steam, but what features cause people to make Steam accounts. In other words, is it actually possible for another player to compete on features alone?

Re:Epic Games Is Acquiring Psyonix by Doxin on Friday May 03, 2019 @04:47AM (#19816675)
You can use both steam and epic simultaneously, there is no need to abandon anything. In your proposed universe I most definitely would be making new purchases on epic wherever possible.

Exclusives of any kind are anti-consumer, whether it is steam doing it or epic.

Re:Epic Games Is Acquiring Psyonix by mikepurvis on Wednesday May 01, 2019 @09:31PM (#19803680)
I think the most expensive thing I've bought on Steam was Cities Skylines, and that was US$30. I originally got my Steam account to redeem Humble Bundle codes— originally that was the only way to get your games; it wasn't until later on that they started cutting Steam out of the loop and offering their own DRM-free downloads.

Anyway, I wonder how many people are in that position, where they have a giant Steam "library" that's mostly bundle titles and stuff bought on special, that they feel some sense of attachment to, but in reality wouldn't really miss when using a different launcher.

Re:Epic Games Is Acquiring Psyonix by Wowfunhappy on Wednesday May 01, 2019 @09:58PM (#19803848)
> I originally got my Steam account to redeem Humble Bundle codes— originally that was the only way to get your games; it wasn't until later on that they started cutting Steam out of the loop and offering their own DRM-free downloads.

For what it's worth, I think your memory is mistaken here, it's actually kind of the opposite—early on, Humble Bundles always offered DRM-free downloads (in addition to Steam keys), and it was only later on that they began selling some games as keys only. As someone who greatly prefers getting naked executables, I was really sad when this happened.

Check out the page for the second-ever Humble Bundle in 2010 (the first doesn't appear to be in the Internet Archive). DRM-Free downloads are listed as a major selling point. Also, you'll note they advertise Linux support, which wasn't supported by Steam at the time. https://web.archive.org/web/20101215101427/http://www.humble...

As an aside, I actually have Steam keys of all the early Humble Bundle games sitting in my account, unredeemed after all these years. I've been thinking I could sell them if I ever needed emergency cash for some reason, but even though it's a common practice, it feels kind of wrong... I have downloaded and played these games, just not on Steam.

Re:Epic Games Is Acquiring Psyonix by theandrewbailey on Thursday May 02, 2019 @09:02AM (#19807412)
All (minus a handful) of the Linux compatible Steam games I have are from Humble Bundles.

I'm skeptical that those unused Steam keys would have much value, given routine Steam sales. I've compiled a list of my Humble Bundle games with unredeemed keys (game names only, not the keys themselves) into a spreadsheet for friends.

Re:Epic Games Is Acquiring Psyonix by baroffoos on Wednesday May 01, 2019 @09:49PM (#19803785)
Music streaming services do not compete on content which makes them much nicer to use.
Re:Epic Games Is Acquiring Psyonix by Wowfunhappy on Wednesday May 01, 2019 @10:12PM (#19803936)
Huh, this is actually a good counter-example. I wonder why that is. Tidal tried to compete on exclusives and it doesn't appear to have worked out for them.

Spotify appears to be positioning itself as an destination for exclusive, original audio programs, but those aren't music.

Re:Epic Games Is Acquiring Psyonix by davemp on Wednesday May 01, 2019 @11:01PM (#19804227)
Maybe because music labels don’t want to cede too much control or it could just be an artifact from the FM era.
Re:Epic Games Is Acquiring Psyonix by baud147258 on Thursday May 02, 2019 @04:56AM (#19805985)
> if it were possible to migrate Steam purchases to the Epic Store

Not necessarily migrate, but offer (for free) the same game on Epic if you already have it on Steam; GOG did this for a few games (not that it helped GOG).

Re:Epic Games Is Acquiring Psyonix by Wowfunhappy on Thursday May 02, 2019 @09:02AM (#19807401)
GoG does it for a small, rotating selection of titles, which is good. But for it to make a significant difference, they'd need to be able to move a large majority of people's libraries. That's much harder, given the variety of developers and publishers you’d need to strike deals with. I don’t think it’s feasible, sadly.
Re:Epic Games Is Acquiring Psyonix by theandrewbailey on Thursday May 02, 2019 @08:52AM (#19807293)
GOG still does from time to time. I check this weekly: https://www.gog.com/connect

Edit: You can insert some EA keys from Steam into Origin: https://pcgamingwiki.com/wiki/List_of_Origin-redeemable_game...

Re:Epic Games Is Acquiring Psyonix by m-p-3 on Thursday May 02, 2019 @11:55AM (#19809263)
I wish EA (and other distributors) did something like GOG Connect. IMO I'd be less annoyed if Epic offered something like this for current Rocket League owner in order to keep the userbase as big as possible before they ultimately split it in two.
Re:Epic Games Is Acquiring Psyonix by cloakandswagger on Wednesday May 01, 2019 @09:30PM (#19803673)
>The problem, of course, is that Epic isn't developing original content

And Valve is?

Re:Epic Games Is Acquiring Psyonix by meruru on Wednesday May 01, 2019 @10:00PM (#19803866)
Didn't they just release a card game with Richard Garfield?

I'm not into games myself, but Valve has done tremendous work for gaming on Linux. That alone is enough reason for me to support them.

Re:Epic Games Is Acquiring Psyonix by thejosh on Wednesday May 01, 2019 @10:45PM (#19804127)
And this graph should give you an indication of how well this went: https://steamcharts.com/app/583950#6m
Re:Epic Games Is Acquiring Psyonix by meruru on Wednesday May 01, 2019 @11:03PM (#19804244)
Why is that? Did it turn out to be a bad game? As a fan of Magic: The Gathering I was quite interested in it and the concept looked interesting too.
Re:Epic Games Is Acquiring Psyonix by JauntTrooper on Thursday May 02, 2019 @01:37PM (#19810357)
As someone in their exact target demographic - I play Magic Arena and Hearthstone regularly - I think they messed up the business model. I don’t mind paying $50 for a game or $20 for an expansion, but I hate getting nickeled and dimed and I was put off by the fact that if I ended up really enjoying the game there wasn’t a path to continue playing without continuing to pay every time. Felt like gambling not relaxing.
Re:Epic Games Is Acquiring Psyonix by cloakandswagger on Wednesday May 01, 2019 @11:15PM (#19804305)
Valve has never been good at building progression systems, and that's exactly what killed Artifact.

You get no rewards for playing the game. If you want new cards, you have to spend money on packs or spend money to enter drafts.

This old fashioned "just play the game because it's fun" mentality is dogma to Valve, but nowadays users want and require the Pavlovian reward systems.

Re:Epic Games Is Acquiring Psyonix by Wowfunhappy on Wednesday May 01, 2019 @11:28PM (#19804393)
> This old fashioned "just play the game because it's fun" mentality is dogma to Valve, but nowadays users want and require the Pavlovian reward systems.

Speaking to the choir I suspect, but god do I hate progression systems.

Haven't played Artifact, but I'm really not convinced by the narrative that Valve is removed from this stuff. TF2 and Counter Strike all have loot and inventory systems of their own. They're basically required in any free to play game.

Re:Epic Games Is Acquiring Psyonix by meruru on Thursday May 02, 2019 @12:17AM (#19804671)
Did Hearthstone handle progression better? I believe it's a fairly popular game.
Re:Epic Games Is Acquiring Psyonix by 666lumberjack on Thursday May 02, 2019 @05:34AM (#19806132)
It had an upfront cost (where all the competing card games are F2P) and a cost to play as well as to acquire cards, which put a lot of people off. It is also a more complex game than say Hearthstone, but I think the success of MOBAs proves that complexity is not an inherent barrier to popularity.
Re:Epic Games Is Acquiring Psyonix by yskchu on Wednesday May 01, 2019 @10:50PM (#19804167)
Valve do still develop games, they just focus on maintaining their current games now. Dota 2, CSGO, Team Fortress 2 still gets frequent updates and big enhancements.

There's also SteamVR

Re:Epic Games Is Acquiring Psyonix by Wowfunhappy on Wednesday May 01, 2019 @09:54PM (#19803821)
Well, they were at one point. But I agree, Valve is no better here.
Re:Epic Games Is Acquiring Psyonix by yskchu on Wednesday May 01, 2019 @10:57PM (#19804204)
> The problem, of course, is that Epic isn't developing original content—they're paying for existing content to be removed from Steam.

It depends on how you're defining "original content". I mean, yes they are paying for games to be Epic exclusive, however Epic released Fortnite, so they do have their own big releases

Re:Epic Games Is Acquiring Psyonix by krageon on Thursday May 02, 2019 @02:38AM (#19805328)
> Ultimately, people aren't making Steam accounts because of the Steam workshop or Steam forums or Steam chat or what have you

As a broad generalisation this is baldly wrong. I use a Steam account and buy things there because the platform has the things that you mention (on top of a multiplayer API that generally works pretty well). If it didn't have those things, I wouldn't use it anywhere close to how often I use it now. A very high percentage of the games on it are also available on other platforms (publisher-specific, GoG, the dev) and those are not materially worse than Steam if you only consider distribution.