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Re:UK has banned all Boeing 737 Max 8 aircraft from British ... by crazygringo on Tuesday March 12, 2019 @11:04AM (#19368804)
Somewhere else I saw posted "two's a coincidence, three's a pattern." Right now we're at two.

I'll be genuinely curious to see what results from the investigation -- if this turns out to be a knee-jerk reactions from politicians wanting to look good (when it really is a coincidence), or if this will turn out to truly have been a failure of the FAA's safety processes, and the US will appear negligent for not also banning.

Re:UK has banned all Boeing 737 Max 8 aircraft from British ... by Misdicorl on Tuesday March 12, 2019 @11:15AM (#19368935)
The results of the investigation can't color the decision on whether or not to ground these planes today. Painting this as a knee-jerk reaction if grounding these planes is wrong and negligent if grounding the planes is right is crazy.
Re:UK has banned all Boeing 737 Max 8 aircraft from British ... by CydeWeys on Tuesday March 12, 2019 @11:11AM (#19368888)
When each instance costs over a hundred lives, you can't afford to wait to establish the pattern for sure. Better to be cautious. The vast majority of planes flying these routes aren't yet the 737 MAX.
Re:UK has banned all Boeing 737 Max 8 aircraft from British ... by mberning on Tuesday March 12, 2019 @11:05AM (#19368824)
Very well could end up being a “Toyota unintended acceleration” type event. Being that it is a newer model operator error is just as plausible as a design or mechanical flaw.
Re:UK has banned all Boeing 737 Max 8 aircraft from British ... by ceejayoz on Tuesday March 12, 2019 @11:11AM (#19368883)
https://boeing.mediaroom.com/news-releases-statements?item=1...

> For the past several months and in the aftermath of Lion Air Flight 610, Boeing has been developing a flight control software enhancement for the 737 MAX, designed to make an already safe aircraft even safer. This includes updates to the Maneuvering Characteristics Augmentation System (MCAS) flight control law, pilot displays, operation manuals and crew training. The enhanced flight control law incorporates angle of attack (AOA) inputs, limits stabilizer trim commands in response to an erroneous angle of attack reading, and provides a limit to the stabilizer command in order to retain elevator authority.

That they're pushing a software patch for this would seem to indicate there's something in the actual plane worth fixing.

Re:UK has banned all Boeing 737 Max 8 aircraft from British ... by rootusrootus on Tuesday March 12, 2019 @11:27AM (#19369052)
It could also be interpreted as changing the plane because the pilot is harder to fix. Sometimes you have to accept that the user is going to do things their way, and adjust the software to match that expectation.
Re:UK has banned all Boeing 737 Max 8 aircraft from British ... by CydeWeys on Tuesday March 12, 2019 @11:13AM (#19368913)
They purposely minimized the differences so it wouldn't require a new type certification, which saves airlines money and thus makes the plane a more appealing proposition.

It does seem to be partly operator error, and that operator error is Boeing's fault because they did things in a way that maximized the chance of it occurring.

Re:UK has banned all Boeing 737 Max 8 aircraft from British ... by mberning on Tuesday March 12, 2019 @11:16AM (#19368947)
My understanding is that the MCAS was required by the FAA for certification.
Re:UK has banned all Boeing 737 Max 8 aircraft from British ... by vvillena on Tuesday March 12, 2019 @11:13AM (#19368909)
The issue is that Boeing added a software layer to make the plane behave like the old 737, so pilots would be able to fly it without any extra training or additional certifications.

If it turns out that the pilots actually need some training to reliably fly the 737 MAX, there could be some nasty consequences for Boeing.

Re:UK has banned all Boeing 737 Max 8 aircraft from British ... by sjburt on Tuesday March 12, 2019 @11:18AM (#19368968)
Everyone is quick to assume an MCAS malfunction for the Ethiopian Air crash but eyewitnesses reported smoke and flames coming from the plane, which seems to indicate something else.
Re:UK has banned all Boeing 737 Max 8 aircraft from British ... by ceejayoz on Tuesday March 12, 2019 @11:32AM (#19369104)
https://www.researchgate.net/publication/268513973_Reliabili...

> At an airshow in 1952, a supersonic fighter disintegrated in the air causing the death of both crew and 29 spectators (Staff, 1952). Over 100,000 people witnessed the accident. A public appeal was put out for witness accounts and photographs to help solve the mystery, resulting in several thousand letters being collected. Rivas and Bullen (2008) found “many of the accounts are touchingly detailed and well intentioned, but the whole of the vast mail was of little use” (p. 186). The vital clue that led to determination of probable cause was supplied by a cine film. The in-flight breakup happened in less than a second, and almost all the eyewitnesses, including experienced pilots, gave grossly inaccurate accounts when compared to the film record.

Re:UK has banned all Boeing 737 Max 8 aircraft from British ... by rootusrootus on Tuesday March 12, 2019 @11:29AM (#19369073)
There are always witnesses to plane crashes who will tell you it was on fire, whether true or not. The safest assumption is that we have no idea what happened but we trust in the NTSB to be quick with their recommendations.
Re:UK has banned all Boeing 737 Max 8 aircraft from British ... by kakwa_ on Tuesday March 12, 2019 @11:34AM (#19369131)
Not necessarily, IIRC, with a stalled airplane the engines can surge, which pretty much look like a plane on fire from the ground.

I'm not 100% certain however, if someone can say if I'm wrong or not, he is welcome ^^.

Re:UK has banned all Boeing 737 Max 8 aircraft from British ... by glasslion on Tuesday March 12, 2019 @10:20PM (#19375118)
I am a fan of the Mayday(Air Crash Investigation) tv series, you can always find eyewitnesses report smoke and fire in any air cash despite the real cause.
Re:UK has banned all Boeing 737 Max 8 aircraft from British ... by exien on Tuesday March 12, 2019 @11:12AM (#19368891)
I really really hope we never get to three crashes.