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Re:Farms, More Productive Than Ever, Are Poisoning Drinking ... by apacheCamel on Friday January 18, 2019 @03:10PM (#18942560)
It is sad to see all the ramifications of these large operations. Between environmental and economical impacts of the area around them, how do we let these get so big? I wonder how many other families are being hurt by the CAFO near your family's farm. I feel for the people who are just trying to run a sustainable business with these huge farms constantly looming in the background.
Re:Farms, More Productive Than Ever, Are Poisoning Drinking ... by waffle_ss on Friday January 18, 2019 @03:18PM (#18942627)
> how do we let these get so big?

My understanding is there was a big change in policy during Nixon's administration, when agribusiness lobbyist Earl "Rusty" Butz became USDA secretary.[1] His mottos were "get big or get out" and "plant fence row to fence row."

[1]: https://grist.org/article/the-butz-stops-here/

Re:Farms, More Productive Than Ever, Are Poisoning Drinking ... by _jal on Friday January 18, 2019 @09:52PM (#18945029)
It is because the externalities of such operations aren't priced in. They are allowed to privatize profit and socialize poison.

If you want to fix such problems, fix the incentives that cause them.

Re:Farms, More Productive Than Ever, Are Poisoning Drinking ... by cpursley on Friday January 18, 2019 @03:19PM (#18942647)
> how do we let these get so big

Farm subsidies (artificially cheap grains for feeding cattle) and the inheritance tax (children are forced to sell the land after parents die due to tax obligations)

Re:Farms, More Productive Than Ever, Are Poisoning Drinking ... by woodruffw on Friday January 18, 2019 @03:41PM (#18942856)
The 2018 individual inheritance tax doesn't apply to inheritances below $5.6 million per individual ($11.2 million for couples)[1]. I suspect that relatively few small farmers are impacted by it.

[1]: https://www.forbes.com/sites/ashleaebeling/2017/10/19/irs-an...

Re:Farms, More Productive Than Ever, Are Poisoning Drinking ... by jcranmer on Friday January 18, 2019 @05:09PM (#18943572)
There were 682 estates in 2016 that contained farm assets subject to the estate tax, and on average about 5% of taxable assets on such estates were farm assets, while about 80% of the assets of family farms are family farm assets.

That suggests that the number of family farmers caught by the estate tax each year can be counted on your hands. And even then, farmers (unlike everybody else) get 15 years to pay off the estate tax. So, yeah, politicians claiming to hate the estate tax because of its negative impact on small farms are lying their ass off.

Re:Farms, More Productive Than Ever, Are Poisoning Drinking ... by moorhosj on Friday January 18, 2019 @04:02PM (#18943045)
==children are forced to sell the land after parents die due to tax obligations==

Do you have a source for this? If true, wouldn't they just sell a portion of the land to cover the tax, as it only kicks in over $5.5 million?

Re:Farms, More Productive Than Ever, Are Poisoning Drinking ... by GlenTheMachine on Friday January 18, 2019 @04:36PM (#18943344)
I'm in this situation -- when my mom passes, me and my brothers will inherit the family farm of 320 acres in central VA. As far as I can tell there's no inheritance tax involved.

Just in case, decades ago my dad put the land in a family partnership of which me and my siblings each own 19%. So even if inheritance tax was a thing for family farms, there are ways around it.

We'll have to pay property tax on it, but that's around $3000 per year.

Re:Farms, More Productive Than Ever, Are Poisoning Drinking ... by Wowfunhappy on Friday January 18, 2019 @08:53PM (#18944775)
> Just in case, decades ago my dad put the land in a family partnership of which me and my siblings each own 19%.

Is it that easy to bypass the estate tax? I'm surprised it collects basically any money at all, if all you have to do is make your children "co-owners" before you die.

Re:Farms, More Productive Than Ever, Are Poisoning Drinking ... by dbcurtis on Friday January 18, 2019 @05:55PM (#18943908)
It absolutely was a thing in the 1970’s. I saw neighbor’s farms destroyed by the inheritance tax. The law was changed, so now the inheritance tax kicks in at a much higher level. Most farmers set up trusts now anyway.

It wasn’t only farmers that got clobbered by the inheritance tax. The children of the local shoe store owner were in the same inheritance tax hell.

Re:Farms, More Productive Than Ever, Are Poisoning Drinking ... by Latteland on Tuesday January 22, 2019 @01:05PM (#18970554)
Was this in the 70s or more recent? I can't imagine a shoe store that costs more than $5 million.
Re:Farms, More Productive Than Ever, Are Poisoning Drinking ... by dbg31415 on Friday January 18, 2019 @05:32PM (#18943746)
My family ranch was in North Dakota.

Most ranches and farms are set up so that there isn't much value if you don't sell the whole thing.

You need land, the homestead (house, barn, shop, corals...), a water source (ideally multiple), roads in and out, fences carved the right way...

Yes, you could likely sell a portion of the property, but the parts aren't worth the same as the whole. You'd likely eat the cost of adding in new windmills, water storage tanks, and developing the land in order to get it to sell if you were to carve out a part of your existing pastures and put it on the market.

We basically ended up carving off the farm land and selling that, but we had to pay to put a road in... and fences on either side of the road, cattle guards, and it ended up costing $100k in materials and labor (since we had to hire people to do it given nobody lived out there any more)... all just to make $300k.

TL;DR: Ranches are set up to be units, and while you can sell part of the land, it sucks to do so.

Re:Farms, More Productive Than Ever, Are Poisoning Drinking ... by kickout on Friday January 18, 2019 @03:26PM (#18942709)
Disagree BTW. Subsidies are an easy target. Affect very little to the bottom lines I've been privy to (managing input price is biggest factor IMO).

Subsidies are an artifact of scale--optics look bad when a big operation is getting 100K USD when they farm 10k acres

Re:Farms, More Productive Than Ever, Are Poisoning Drinking ... by gyrgtyn on Friday January 18, 2019 @03:38PM (#18942822)
Is corn not an input?
Re:Farms, More Productive Than Ever, Are Poisoning Drinking ... by kickout on Friday January 18, 2019 @03:41PM (#18942854)
In dairy farms yes. Was trying to generalize.