I think you were downvoted because you miss the point. Apache's stand is against Oracle, not Java, and Stallman's issues with Java were with licensing not the language/JVM really.

Stallman is a leader not because he must create something better than Java, but instead because for any technology the "Free" vs. "Open Source" issue can be critical as to whether you depend on a piece of software.

In my experience, a combination of Python and C/C++, Lua/C++, or even just plain C++ with a good library like Qt offer better performance and productivity. And Open Office is not a good example, desktop applications are definitely not Java's strength, there are hardly any examples. Java is more dominant than in the "enterprise"/web space.

I think RMS is now pro-Java since OpenJDK came out. Harmony is a tool of capitalist oppression anyway.

Stallman has his ideals, which is fine. However, if Java was never open sourced, he would not be in favor of it. OpenOffice was largely written in C++ because they didn't want to use Java because it wasn't open. Imagine how much more work could have been accomplished if they started with Java. Not that Java is a great, or even pretty, language. It's just a lot easier to work with than C++. Someday, we'll be able to move up another level of abstraction and writing software will again become easier.

My point about Stallman was that he would keep developers in the "stone ages" rather than be practical.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/OpenOffice.org#Use_of_Java

"Practical"? Is that a good thing now?

I don't recall "practical" being synonymous with "awesome" or "excellent". "Practical" is an excellent excuse for not having principle.

I have some issues with RMS' beliefs, but I applaud the fact that he acts on principle. I wish I had embraced principle over practicality and had continued working with Ruby, rather than taking a 5 year detour through PHPland.

OpenOffice might not be the best example since it's older than Java: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oracle_Open_Office#History

MIT had an emacs-like editor written in Scheme. (I can't remember its name. Probably it was the editor written for MIT Scheme?)

Edit: It's Edwin.

Java is the new COBOL, how anyone could think it is a good idea to write anything in it is beyond me.