> Who is "they"?

From the parent comment: "Chinese vendors and mfgs"

I don't understand the complaint in that article? It seems to basically be that:

- Nestle made a baby formula

- They marketed it heavily to poor people in the third world.

- Poor people in the third world proceed to dilute the formula with more than the recommended amount of water to save money (and the article does not say that this was at Nestle's prompting), and as a result didn't feed their babies enough.

Maybe less than ideal and somewhat scummy? Sure, most advertising is like that really. Worse than literally selling poisonous baby formula? I don't see it.

But perhaps I misunderstand the accusation.

I'd heard part of the problem was that Nestlé lied to mothers to make them think they needed it, gave them enough for free that their own breast-milk dried up making them dependent on formula to feed their child at which point many were stuck with an expense they couldn't actually afford leading to things like diluting the formula. Certainly not as bad as outright poisoning formula, but a shitty thing in general to poverty stricken areas who were more than capable of feeding their own babies for free before Nestlé took advantage of them to take what little those mothers had.

But this is nowhere near the same thing as the Chinese baby milk melamine scandal, as well as more localized fake baby milk powder scandals. In fact, people go to HK to buy so much baby milk powder that they had prevent export.

We are comparing a non defective product that couldn’t be used effectively by a certain populations to outright fraud.

I can see a product designer make the case that if millions are dying, then the product is defective in some way. The rules are different in two different places, but I can see how someone thinks these two cases are similar, both are about corporate greed, and the victims are just statistics. Is it murder if there is something wrong with the product, and you don't pull it? Many people out there believe that it is:

https://www.odwyerpr.com/story/public/5379/2015-09-18/gm-pay...

Well, one is against the law and the other is not and, in fact, couldn’t be without serious implications to personal freedom. One messes with the truthfulness of the information an informed consumer has available, the other simply relies on an uninformed consumer. These are not similar at all.

As an analogy, take sugary snacks. Say a snack has lots of sugar but the company claims it is sugar free anyways. In another case, a snack is truthful about its sugar content but the consumer lacks the education (or willpower) to care. Aren’t these completely different problems?

It depends on how innocent you think Nestle is. I can understand why someone would conclude that there is some "messing with the truthfulness" going on at Nestle. Both in the product design, and the marketing. It's why a lot of people call it a "scandal." I think this is less about laws for people who compare the two and more about morals. In one you have dozens dead, in the other, the claim is that millions died. Both are about corporations and profit and gaming the system and manipulating consumers, so in that sense, I think it's easy to make the case that they are extremely similar.

I think only a fringe call that a scandal since it doesn't involve outright deception. It all depends on whether you think someone should save people from themselves.

Sugar has probably killed more than millions, which has definitely been driven by corporate profits and gaming the system (substituting sugar for fat). But again, Coke Cola and Mars (and yes, Nestle) haven't been consider a scandal yet.

some would call sugar a scandal, probably with valid reasoning too:

https://www.huffpost.com/entry/sugar-harvard-scandal-nutriti...

And they both clearly involve outright deception. The difference is probably just not as many babies dying. At least not yet, cokes aren't advertised as being healthier than breastfeeding for babies.

Formula is healthier than brestfeeding in some aspects (much less chance of an iron deficiency). In much of the world, there is no stigma to formula feeding a baby; I think it is mainly the USA that has gone on an aggressive breastfeeding campaign in the last few years.

the numbers are definitely worse. "millions" dead? that sounds pretty bad. Not sure how true that is. It certainly isn't clear. But the idea that a western corporation will do something like changing a product to save money, or not recalling a product knowing that someone out there will die... do you really need to be given examples of that?

Millions died because mother's diluted the formula, against the instructions of the company. How is that Nestle's fault?

Nestle marketed the formula heavily as a safe substitute for breast milk despite the fact they knew many Africans didn't have access to safe drinking water to make the formula, they sold it heavily discounted.

Mothers bought it and used it so their own breast milk dried up. Then when they couldn't afford enough of it as the baby grew and needed more, they were forced to ration the formula.

Millions died.

> stealing, lying, and poisoning Americans is part of Chinese culture.

National/racial smears are unacceptable here. If you use HN for nationalistic flamewar again we will ban you.

Cutting corners to make items cheaper and make more money without govt regulation is capitalism and the end goal for the ruling American party (GOP). See their recent attacks on the EPA.

> poisoning Americans is part of Chinese culture .

WTF is wrong with you? Why are there humans on HN like you?

BTW the Chinese who poisoned their own countrymen in pursuit of profit were put to death, while the Americans who do the same to this day in Flint, Michigan and other places are still alive and they're still poisoning Americans. Is it American culture to poison your countrymen?

Flint crisis is over.

I think you missed the point.

The Chinese melamine scandal is over too.

And yet I can't buy a tin of baby formula because it's all sold out instantly.

But not the lead crisis.

> The point is that stealing, lying, and poisoning Americans is part of Chinese culture.

That's a pretty repulsive sentiment, and it's rich too coming from an American like yourself. Not surprising that it garners plenty of upvotes on a cesspool like "Hacker" News.

> Not surprising that it garners plenty of upvotes on a cesspool like "Hacker" News.

Since it's both flagged (from user flags) and dead (from user downvotes), I don't think that comment is warranted.