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Re:Do we really live longer than our ancestors? by sandworm101 on Wednesday October 03, 2018 @05:31PM (#18135002)
Be careful when reading about the age "40" and "80" in some ancient cultures. "40" used to be a term for "many", as we might say "millions" when we really mean "a great many". Mohammed was 40 when he received god's message. Ali Baba had his 40 thieves. Moses wandered in the desert for 40 years. The Noah suffered 40 days and nights of rain. There is a famous story in Islam of a woman being stung by a scorpion 40 times while at prayer. So a tale of a woman being 80 years old, a suspicious doubling of 40, should probably be read to say that she was very very old rather than literally eighty.
Re:Do we really live longer than our ancestors? by NeedMoreTea on Wednesday October 03, 2018 @06:11PM (#18135263)
To the disbelievers and downvoters this is true.

I was going to say it stems from Abrahamic tradition, and biblical use as a period of trial, but Wikipedia tells me "The number 40 is used in Jewish, Christian, Islamic, and other Middle Eastern traditions to represent a large, approximate number", with some other older traditions shown.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/40_%28number%29

Presumably Pratchett's inspiration for the Troll number system (many-many-lots) :)

Re:Do we really live longer than our ancestors? by agapon on Thursday October 04, 2018 @06:40AM (#18138675)
[Eastern] Slavic cultures historically used 40 to mean a lot, many. And forty of forties (40 of 40s) means 'great great many'.
Re:Do we really live longer than our ancestors? by GoMonad on Wednesday October 03, 2018 @05:41PM (#18135080)
That's super interesting. Do you have a reference where I can read more about this?
Re:Do we really live longer than our ancestors? by clear_dg on Wednesday October 03, 2018 @06:12PM (#18135265)
Re:Do we really live longer than our ancestors? by jdironman on Wednesday October 03, 2018 @05:53PM (#18135161)
I second this request. Seems like long ago I might have heard such a reference to 40 meaning many from grandparents but cannot be certain.
Re:Do we really live longer than our ancestors? by saalweachter on Wednesday October 03, 2018 @07:10PM (#18135568)
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/40_(number)#In_religion

Looks like it also needs a [citation needed].

Re:Do we really live longer than our ancestors? by red369 on Wednesday October 03, 2018 @10:42PM (#18136716)
There are slightly better citations at: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Indefinite_and_fictitious_numb...

The Concise Oxford Turkish Dictionary, Oxford, 1959, s.v. kırk: "Forty; used especially to denote a large indefinite number

Re:Do we really live longer than our ancestors? by mamcx on Wednesday October 03, 2018 @05:57PM (#18135180)
This sound incredible unbelievable. Also, all the cultures across centuries use the same idea?

Exist many samples of the use of numbers in the thousands, btw..

Re:Do we really live longer than our ancestors? by yen223 on Thursday October 04, 2018 @12:56AM (#18137300)
There are, like, a million cultures out there that use an arbitrarily large number to mean "a lot" ;)
Re:Do we really live longer than our ancestors? by kmm on Wednesday October 03, 2018 @07:15PM (#18135596)
Mohammed, the people who told the story of Ali Baba and the ancient Jews all spoke Semitic languages. As with a lot of metaphors, it might have come with the language. Like how early Indo-European cultures had patrilocality and sky gods
Re:Do we really live longer than our ancestors? by int_19h on Thursday October 04, 2018 @07:49AM (#18139004)
Things like these can jump across language and culture boundaries easily, too.

In Russian, there's a fairly obvious pattern to numerals like 20, 30, 50, 60, 70, 80, 90. It's not super consistent, but you can easily pick each of those apart and see that it references the corresponding digit, plus some variation of "ten".

Note that I didn't list 40. That's because it's special - it has its own word for it, that is completely unrelated to the word for 4 or any other number. Its etymology is contested, but it's certain that it was already special many centuries back, and used to count things (in groups of 40). And then you have archaic idioms like "forty forties", which basically means "hell of a lot".

Of course, it can well just be convergent evolution - there's only so many round numbers. And then if you pick one as the standard size of the group for counting, and it's large enough, then a square of that number is also a fairly natural choice for "many". But identical choices in other cultures might give the initial push, or reinforce one of the early roughly equal candidates.

Re:Do we really live longer than our ancestors? by OJFord on Wednesday October 03, 2018 @06:31PM (#18135363)
It doesn't take much to find a common root among cultures, once willing to look 'across centuries'.