3M Knew About the Dangers of PFOA and PFOS Decades Ago, Internal Documents Show

Re:3M Knew About the Dangers of PFOA and PFOS Decades Ago, I... by nostrademons on Friday August 03, 2018 @11:54AM (#17680875)

"Social networks knew all along that the dopamine-based intermittent reward system of their products was causing decreased attention spans, addictive behaviors, and mental illness, but continued expanding until the whole globe was in a stupor."

[ Parent | on HN ]

Re:3M Knew About the Dangers of PFOA and PFOS Decades Ago, I... by nealabq on Friday August 03, 2018 @12:07PM (#17680977)

From Sleeper (1973), set in a future USA:

Dr. Melik: This morning for breakfast he requested something called "wheat germ, organic honey and tiger's milk."

Dr. Aragon: [chuckling] Oh, yes. Those are the charmed substances that some years ago were thought to contain life-preserving properties.

Dr. Melik: You mean there was no deep fat? No steak or cream pies or... hot fudge?

Dr. Aragon: Those were thought to be unhealthy... precisely the opposite of what we now know to be true.

Dr. Melik: Incredible.

https://www.imdb.com/title/tt0070707/quotes

[ Parent | on HN ]

Re:3M Knew About the Dangers of PFOA and PFOS Decades Ago, I... by thatjsguy on Friday August 03, 2018 @11:51AM (#17680838)

“Food and drink companies knew all along that sugar was making you obese and diabetic.”

[ Parent | on HN ]

Re:3M Knew About the Dangers of PFOA and PFOS Decades Ago, I... by ncw33 on Friday August 03, 2018 @11:54AM (#17680877)

The difference is that most/all sugars are not inherently harmful, and we believe that they can be consumed safely at reasonable doses. A bit of glucose or fructose won't kill you, and is a (small) natural component of your diet. So banning sugar would be rather hard, compared to complex toxic chemicals which can't be processed by our bodies, decay slowly, and where we really have fairly limited reason to put in products.

[ Parent | on HN ]

Re:3M Knew About the Dangers of PFOA and PFOS Decades Ago, I... by pygy_ on Friday August 03, 2018 @12:04PM (#17680960)

The problem is at least twofold:

- some foodstuff is optimized for addictiveness, with far too much sugar, starting at the craddle.

- nutrition science has been purposefully sent in the wrong direction for decades.

[ Parent | on HN ]

Re:3M Knew About the Dangers of PFOA and PFOS Decades Ago, I... by tarwater11 on Friday August 03, 2018 @12:04PM (#17680961)

Fat (edit: typically) causes type 2 diabetes, not sugar.

[ Parent | on HN ]

Re:3M Knew About the Dangers of PFOA and PFOS Decades Ago, I... by Verdex_3 on Friday August 03, 2018 @12:18PM (#17681092)

Is this what your meant to write?

I've worked on diabetes medical devices for about 8 years, did some research on diabetes to augment my ability to work on said diabetes medical devices, and personally know several people with type 1 diabetes and as well type 2 diabetes.

Did you mean instead to write: Sugar causes type 2 diabetes, not fat?

[ Parent | on HN ]

Re:3M Knew About the Dangers of PFOA and PFOS Decades Ago, I... by tarwater11 on Friday August 03, 2018 @12:51PM (#17681411)

https://nutritionfacts.org/2016/11/17/fat-is-the-cause-of-ty...

I suppose high sugar consumption could cause it, but it doesn't look like that is the typical mechanism.

[ Parent | on HN ]

Re:3M Knew About the Dangers of PFOA and PFOS Decades Ago, I... by mrfredward on Friday August 03, 2018 @01:26PM (#17681701)

Michael Greger, the author of that post, owns the website nutritionfacts.org. He appears to be taking the celebrity doctor career route, since his bio boasts about the lectures he gives and appearing on the Dr. Oz show.

Shows us something peer reviewed.

Edit: I haven't found anything to definitively say Greger is a quack, but given that searching his name brings up mainly alternative medicine type sites, I remain suspicious.

[ Parent | on HN ]

Re:3M Knew About the Dangers of PFOA and PFOS Decades Ago, I... by newnewpdro on Friday August 03, 2018 @12:18PM (#17681094)

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lifestyle_causes_of_diabetes_m...

[ Parent | on HN ]

Re:3M Knew About the Dangers of PFOA and PFOS Decades Ago, I... by oxide on Friday August 03, 2018 @12:09PM (#17680998)

I would like to read more about this if you wouldn't mind sourcing your facts.

[ Parent | on HN ]

Re:3M Knew About the Dangers of PFOA and PFOS Decades Ago, I... by driverdan on Friday August 03, 2018 @12:10PM (#17681016)

I believe you mean obesity, not dietary fat.

[ Parent | on HN ]

Re:3M Knew About the Dangers of PFOA and PFOS Decades Ago, I... by neffy on Friday August 03, 2018 @11:52AM (#17680862)

Let's just hope articles are still being written in the 2050's

[ Parent | on HN ]

Re:3M Knew About the Dangers of PFOA and PFOS Decades Ago, I... by patmcguire on Friday August 03, 2018 @02:43PM (#17682441)

The science was mostly settled and obvious on climate change, to the extent that the corporate actors with the most incentive to pretend it was nothing acknowledged it. They invested heavily in contingency plans under the assumption that it was only a matter of time until regulation made it untenable to burn fossil fuels for energy on anything like the previous scale. Nothing was done.

[ Parent | on HN ]

Re:3M Knew About the Dangers of PFOA and PFOS Decades Ago, I... by mcny on Friday August 03, 2018 @11:52AM (#17680854)

Lets start with the fairly obvious: DHS and TSA knew the airport scanners cause cancer.

[ Parent | on HN ]

Re:3M Knew About the Dangers of PFOA and PFOS Decades Ago, I... by fogleman on Friday August 03, 2018 @11:52AM (#17680855)

I can't believe people used to _douse their food crops_ with glyphosate!

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Glyphosate

[ Parent | on HN ]

Re:3M Knew About the Dangers of PFOA and PFOS Decades Ago, I... by baud147258 on Friday August 03, 2018 @12:15PM (#17681061)

From one friend which is working in agriculture, glyphosate was used before planting the crops, to remove invasive species. But it does not change the fact that it's toxic to humans.

[ Parent | on HN ]

Re:3M Knew About the Dangers of PFOA and PFOS Decades Ago, I... by pygy_ on Friday August 03, 2018 @02:01PM (#17682008)

Glyphosate is also used to get cereals to dry up faster once they've grown enough.

[ Parent | on HN ]

Re:3M Knew About the Dangers of PFOA and PFOS Decades Ago, I... by driverdan on Friday August 03, 2018 @12:09PM (#17681003)

Doubtful. Glyphosate is one of the safest and most effective herbicides developed. If we develop alternatives to herbicides, such as GMOs or different growing methods, I can see that reaction to herbicides in general but not specifically glyphosate.

[ Parent | on HN ]

Re:3M Knew About the Dangers of PFOA and PFOS Decades Ago, I... by lumberjack on Friday August 03, 2018 @12:14PM (#17681054)

One big one is air pollution. It is huge in terms of health affects on the population but we ignore it because of the feeling that it cannot be helped. When we finally clean our air it is going to seem ridiculous that we accepted our faith to live our whole lives in toxic fumes for two whole centuries.

[ Parent | on HN ]

Re:3M Knew About the Dangers of PFOA and PFOS Decades Ago, I... by onychomys on Friday August 03, 2018 @12:33PM (#17681267)

We've already made huge strides in this. Here's [0] a gallery of shots of LA smog in the middle part of the last century. It's full of pictures of people crying because the air pollution is stinging their eyes. It's nearly unthinkable today, aside from the random winter day in Salt Lake where an inversion traps everything. But it was a daily occurrence back then!

[0] http://www.latimes.com/local/la-me-air-pollution-0428-pictur...

[ Parent | on HN ]

Re:3M Knew About the Dangers of PFOA and PFOS Decades Ago, I... by izzydata on Friday August 03, 2018 @11:51AM (#17680847)

Apple knew all along their phones give you cancer.

(I don't actually believe this is true. Don't hurt me.)

[ Parent | on HN ]

Re:3M Knew About the Dangers of PFOA and PFOS Decades Ago, I... by jbob2000 on Friday August 03, 2018 @12:11PM (#17681024)

"There was a powerful sugar and corn lobby which artificially lowered the price of their goods so healthier, cheaper options could not compete."

[ Parent | on HN ]