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Re:Against an Increasingly User-Hostile Web by s73ver_ on Thursday November 02, 2017 @02:04PM (#15612713)
I wouldn't, because they could just as easily not make the content, and then you wouldn't have it in any form.

And the greater point there, that you appear to have missed, is that content creators don't really owe you anything, unless you've paid them. Thus, their actions are not hostile to you.

Re:Against an Increasingly User-Hostile Web by joepie91_ on Thursday November 02, 2017 @02:21PM (#15612875)
What? That's stringing together a bunch of things that have absolutely nothing to do with each other.

The primary motivation of many "creators" is to gain more income; to that end, they do not need to produce user-friendly content, they just need to produce content that earns money. That doesn't even require maximizing readership.

Aside from that, whether one person is being hostile to another person has absolutely nothing to do with anybody "owing" anybody else anything. These are two totally unrelated concepts.

Re:Against an Increasingly User-Hostile Web by s73ver_ on Thursday November 02, 2017 @02:47PM (#15613134)
No, the idea that something can be "hostile" hinges on the idea that you were entitled to it in the other form to begin with. Someone not providing content in the form you wish is an inconvenience at best.
Re:Against an Increasingly User-Hostile Web by lovich on Thursday November 02, 2017 @05:50PM (#15614601)
I could be hostile to you right now, and you wouldn't have even requested anything from me. Hostility has nothing to do with what someone owes someone else.

Have you ever seen the soup Nazi from Seinfeld? Would you say he's not hostile because no body is owed his soup?

Re:Against an Increasingly User-Hostile Web by s73ver_ on Thursday November 02, 2017 @06:15PM (#15614793)
I just cannot buy this argument. Comparing the Soup Nazi to someone who chose to make content for you, is just ludicrous. For one, the Soup Nazi actively berated people. Someone making videos because they want to make videos is not doing anything close to that to you.

The worst you can claim a video is, is an inconvenience. That's it. Saying it's "hostile" because you'd prefer text is entitlement to the point of craziness.

Re:Against an Increasingly User-Hostile Web by lovich on Friday November 03, 2017 @09:59AM (#15619258)
To me, content creators using psychology tricks to try and get the value out of me, my eyeballs for advertisers, before I have the ability to evaluate their value to me, the actual useful part of their content, is hostile.

Maybe the soup Nazi was a bad analogy, but how about a car salesman who knowingly sells you a lemon? They could be nice and polite up front and do everything they could to make you feel comfortable with making the purchase. They are still knowingly doing something to benefit themselves at your expense. If it was a choice where one side got a benefit and the other remained neutral I would see it as not hostile, but when it's a benefit for one side at the expense of the other side, it's become hostile at that point

Re:Against an Increasingly User-Hostile Web by s73ver_ on Friday November 03, 2017 @12:25PM (#15620355)
Your analogies are not working. They are not at all on point, and they are not at all relatable to the situation.
Re:Against an Increasingly User-Hostile Web by lovich on Friday November 03, 2017 @09:59PM (#15623441)
I think we don't agree on the definition of hostile. For me, if someone does anything to benefit themselves at my loss, it's a hostile act. There is a spectrum, trying to stab me certainly rates higher than trying to squeeze a few pennies out of a deal with me, but it's still hostile
Re:Against an Increasingly User-Hostile Web by hehheh on Thursday November 02, 2017 @08:06PM (#15615554)
You're not the only one here that thinks someone describing something as "hostile" means they feel entitled to have it. I don't agree and I don't understand the connection.

Speaking personally, when I find user-hostile content, I simply leave the page/close the window/throw away the magazine. I don't feel entitled to have the content in any way.

However, I do feel entitled to make an appeal to content producers that they try to come up with a way to make their content less hostile. It's just an appeal, though, and they are absolutely free to ignore it.

Re:Against an Increasingly User-Hostile Web by tomc1985 on Thursday November 02, 2017 @02:26PM (#15612934)
> and then you wouldn't have it in any form.

This would be a blessing for much of the "content" out there.

Do they owe me anything? Of course not. But if they want my precious, precious attention and the opportunity to advertise to me then they need to play ball my way. Otherwise, fuck them.

Re:Against an Increasingly User-Hostile Web by s73ver_ on Thursday November 02, 2017 @02:53PM (#15613192)
So don't consume it, instead of complaining that they're being "hostile" to you. Or, even better, create your own content in written form to compete.
Re:Against an Increasingly User-Hostile Web by tomc1985 on Thursday November 02, 2017 @03:02PM (#15613267)
If I could make written content to compete then why would I be watching said video in the first place? The objective of consumption is to learn, but what you advocate only works if one has already learned something.

What about when the video contains exclusive, important trade-related info? Is dismissing someone to go create their own content on exclusive information really a coherent counterargument (or useful strategy)? Do you really want the internet to be even more polluted with more second- and third-source crap than it already is?

Video is creators stroking their egos. The creator is unimportant, only his/her ideas, which internally manifest as words and should be transcribed as cleanly and accurately as possible. Video is an extremely poor medium for most ideas.

Re:Against an Increasingly User-Hostile Web by s73ver_ on Thursday November 02, 2017 @03:26PM (#15613454)
All content creators are stroking their egos.

I'm sorry, but I still see nothing "hostile" about them choosing one medium over the other. You might have a slight inconvenience, but that's it.

If you don't like things being in videos, then write written content to compete with it. Otherwise, stop with the over the top exaggerations and feelings of entitlement from content creators.

Re:Against an Increasingly User-Hostile Web by tomc1985 on Thursday November 02, 2017 @04:32PM (#15614019)
Like I have the time or desire to compete with most of these yokels. We give in some areas and take in others, that's how the world works. Content creators are not some unassailable gift horse immune from inspection or criticism. People are free to criticize the things I contribute to this world; and my feelings will not be hurt if they do. Perhaps you could learn from this.

Video needs smothering, not competition.

Re:Against an Increasingly User-Hostile Web by s73ver_ on Thursday November 02, 2017 @05:47PM (#15614581)
"Like I have the time or desire to compete with most of these yokels."

Then stop complaining.

"Content creators are not some unassailable gift horse immune from inspection or criticism. People are free to criticize the things I contribute to this world; and my feelings will not be hurt if they do. Perhaps you could learn from this."

But you're not criticizing. You're getting all in a tizzy because others aren't doing things exactly the way you want them. You're demanding that your entitlement be fulfilled.

"Video needs smothering, not competition."

Not according to the vast amounts of people who find it just fine. If you wish to prove that another medium is better, then feel free to create competing content in that medium to show it.

Re:Against an Increasingly User-Hostile Web by tomc1985 on Thursday November 02, 2017 @06:42PM (#15614997)
So one should just be happy with everything they have, dislike, and cannot change or compete on? How is that a reasonable expectation?

"Vast amounts of people"? Vast amounts of people kill other vast amounts of people, are you ok with that? Vast amounts of people vote for laws that screw over other vast amounts of people, is that cool? A vast amount of people boarded the Titanic, look where that got them...

If some idiot Youtube personality wants to flap their jaws for an hour, droning on and on about whatever stupid pointless thing in their life is stuck in their craw or whatever, fine. But for information dispersal, unless the video is densely packed with visual content, it needs to be text. Doers all over the world will thank you.

Entitlement is, if anything, forcing poor viewers to sit through a 15-minute life-story-slash-prologue just so they can continue to participate in a Reddit discussion or finish their task or whatever.