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Re:Looking for Work After 25 Years of Octave by Swizec on Wednesday February 08, 2017 @08:58PM (#13603999)
> There's something fundamentally broken about the open-source model when you can invest so much time and npt get any sort of economic return. This seems like a huge limiting factor on open-source development.

The problem we have is that OSS creators don't realize, and often willfully ignore, the fact that nothing about opensource says you can't charge for delivering value to people. Sure, their ability to copy it themselves and do stuff might reduce your leverage, but I can almost promise you that a company which generates $10,000,000/year of revenue and relies on your software, will throw money at you if you ask. Especially if you say something like "You know, since you're not paying me for this, I can totally stop maintaining it at any point and then you'll be fucked because your business relies on this".

But many engineers don't like to be business people. So here we all are.

It's really not that hard: Do people's livelihoods and businesses rely on your work? Are you improving people's lives? Charge.

Doing it for fun and no interest in making a business? That's fine, but don't expect to make a living off of a thing you're not charging money for.

Re:Looking for Work After 25 Years of Octave by anigbrowl on Wednesday February 08, 2017 @09:38PM (#13604183)
I think this is maybe a reaction to the way AT&T made Unix so expensive and inaccessible to hackers for so long that the idea of charging $$$ for something whose marginal cost of production was effectively $0 that the idea of charging money was morally repulsive to a lot of key figures in the movement.

In a way OSS seems like the sort of thing that would have worked great in some hypothetical enlightened communist system that didn't suppress liberty.

Re:Looking for Work After 25 Years of Octave by pjmlp on Thursday February 09, 2017 @04:27AM (#13605684)
> AT&T made Unix so expensive and inaccessible to hacker

Actually you got it wrong, it was precisely because AT&T could not legally charge the prices other vendors were selling their OSes, that UNIX got adopted by universities and small business, thus spreading its use in the industry.

The ones charging lots of money for UNIX clones were Sun, HP, Digital, HP, ...

Re:Looking for Work After 25 Years of Octave by anigbrowl on Thursday February 09, 2017 @02:36PM (#13610109)
I thought sun was in partnership with AT&T when system V came out, and https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_Unix appears to support that idea, but my first-hand memories have dimmed with time (cause it's not something I care about that much) and you may well be right.

I do remember, um, liberating an overlooked copy of system V/386 on 5.25" floppies that I found in a storage cupboard when I worked at PC Magazine in 1992 :-)

Re:Looking for Work After 25 Years of Octave by pjmlp on Thursday February 09, 2017 @02:52PM (#13610280)
If you have some time to refresh memory.

"A Narrative History of BSD by Dr. Kirk McKusick"

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ds77e3aO9nA

"Unix came into many CS departments largely because it was the only powerful interactive system that could run on the sort of hardware (PDP-11s) that universities could afford in the mid '70s. In addition, Unix itself was also very inexpensive. Since source code was provided, it was a system that could be shaped to the requirements of a particular installation."

http://www.princeton.edu/~hos/frs122/unixhist/chen.htm

Re:Looking for Work After 25 Years of Octave by anigbrowl on Thursday February 09, 2017 @09:21PM (#13612805)
Thanks, this looks enjoyable and informative.
Re:Looking for Work After 25 Years of Octave by Swizec on Wednesday February 08, 2017 @09:53PM (#13604243)
Sure, marginal cost is $0, I agree. But building and maintaning huge swathes of million (billion?) dollar infrastructures/architectures for enterprises for free feels somehow more wrong than building a small business that supports a few maintainers' families.

Or as a famous talk once said: fuck you, pay me.

https://creativemornings.com/talks/mike-monteiro--2/1

Re:Looking for Work After 25 Years of Octave by anigbrowl on Thursday February 09, 2017 @01:59AM (#13605200)
Indeed. I'm just making a guess about the motivations of some OSS leaders, and a shallow one at that.
Re:Looking for Work After 25 Years of Octave by josephagoss on Wednesday February 08, 2017 @09:10PM (#13604065)
You're entirely correct here. These OSS creators have leverage but are either unaware or unwilling to take advantage of their advantageous position.
Re:Looking for Work After 25 Years of Octave by toomuchtodo on Wednesday February 08, 2017 @09:14PM (#13604081)
Is there no middle ground between OSS maintainers/contributors going hungry and them holding businesses hostage for ransom?
Re:Looking for Work After 25 Years of Octave by beambot on Wednesday February 08, 2017 @10:24PM (#13604407)
Indeed, there is: market segmentation.
Re:Looking for Work After 25 Years of Octave by josephagoss on Wednesday February 08, 2017 @09:54PM (#13604253)
To be honest I hope there is middle ground, I just cannot see it. I want OSSc creators to be well compensated. These people are providing the world with an incredible service.
Re:Looking for Work After 25 Years of Octave by trome on Wednesday February 08, 2017 @11:48PM (#13604748)
Entire businesses like Red Hat & Suse are built on the middle ground. There is room in the market for OSS creators to be compensated for their work.
Re:Looking for Work After 25 Years of Octave by anigbrowl on Thursday February 09, 2017 @02:01AM (#13605216)
True, but not everyone wants to be part of a business. What if there were some umbrella nonprofit that collected funds for open source development and redistributed to various projects in approximate proportion to their deployment in production, as well as seed or micro-capital to encourage new contributions?
Re:Looking for Work After 25 Years of Octave by tavert on Thursday February 09, 2017 @02:12AM (#13605256)
You mean like http://www.numfocus.org ? That's not quite how their fiscal sponsorship agreements work, but close enough.
Re:Looking for Work After 25 Years of Octave by anigbrowl on Thursday February 09, 2017 @02:43PM (#13610182)
Did not know about this. Thanks for sharing, this is very encouraging to see.
Re:Looking for Work After 25 Years of Octave by krylon on Thursday February 09, 2017 @03:28AM (#13605474)
I may have been misunderstanding the whole thing, but wasn't the FSF supposed to kind of do that (among other things, but still)?
Re:Looking for Work After 25 Years of Octave by anigbrowl on Thursday February 09, 2017 @02:42PM (#13610175)
I'm not sure, I haven't followed the topic closely enough in recent years to form an opinion.
Re:Looking for Work After 25 Years of Octave by dboreham on Thursday February 09, 2017 @01:17AM (#13605077)
Have you actually tried this?
Re:Looking for Work After 25 Years of Octave by Swizec on Thursday February 09, 2017 @01:35AM (#13605120)
Similar. I put out free technical blogs and charge for technical books. For a demographic that's allergic to paying, engineers are really profitable.

An extra $30k/year is pretty nice for a sidehustle I think. Mostly on track to do double that this year.

And of course, if a company asks for consulting, I charge. But I'm not focusing on consulting these days.

However a company is paying me to develop tech material for them as a content marketing strategy. At $600/article it's not a bad gig and I'm probably undercharging.

So .. uh .. the answer to your question is Yes, sortof.

You can read more about it here: https://swizec.com/blog/learned-6x-income-4-years/swizec/734...