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Re:Live Presidential Forecast by RandomOpinion on Tuesday November 08, 2016 @11:11PM (#12905985)
Not surprised; a day of reckoning was bound to come for the left. Consider that even if Trump had lost, his power base would still have existed afterward. Trump is not the problem, Trump is a symptom.

The American left took its eyes off of what's important, namely the working class, and instead spent its time and political capital on frivolous[0] causes. This is a wake-up call to refocus.

[0] Lots of things some might consider important are frivolous when you're living paycheck-to-paycheck.

Re:Live Presidential Forecast by basch on Wednesday November 09, 2016 @12:17AM (#12906279)
This isnt a day of reckoning for the Left. He hijacked the GOP against its own will and destroyed the DNC. That's a collapse of two establishment parties, not one.
[dead]
Re:Live Presidential Forecast by RandomOpinion on Tuesday November 08, 2016 @11:51PM (#12906136)
Stop. The. Name. Calling. Stop it right now. Even if your demographic breakdown were correct[0], those are your fellow citizens your're referring to. That tone is why the left is in the state it is right now.

Trump is, perhaps, not going to help "those people" but neither, in their minds, was Clinton. They are simply going with the "perhaps" rather than (again, in their mind) certain no.

[0] For example, suburbanites support Trump in about equal numbers and about 1/3 of college graduates and postgraduates support Trump. https://www.washingtonpost.com/graphics/politics/2016-electi...

Re:Live Presidential Forecast by coderdude on Tuesday November 08, 2016 @11:56PM (#12906164)
Arguing to stop the name-calling is about as effective on HN as it would be on the YouTube comments for a John Oliver video. HN is decidedly slanted on this matter. It's business as usual for democrats to call people names if you don't agree with them. Has been for as long as I can remember.
Re:Live Presidential Forecast by RandomOpinion on Wednesday November 09, 2016 @12:14AM (#12906264)
You'd be surprised. The left is no more unified that the right, in many ways, and members of the mainstream left have been cautioning against this derisive labeling issue for quite some time now. See, for example, Rensin's "The smug style in American liberalism" linked to on HN at https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=12106004
Re:Live Presidential Forecast by coderdude on Wednesday November 09, 2016 @12:15AM (#12906272)
Interesting. I'll check it out.
Re:Live Presidential Forecast by throwanem on Wednesday November 09, 2016 @12:30AM (#12906355)
It's a good article. If modern progressivism were remotely at home to wisdom of the sort it offers, I wouldn't have cast a ballot for Trump today.
Re:Live Presidential Forecast by ant6n on Wednesday November 09, 2016 @01:23AM (#12906686)
Sorry, I'm not a conservative.
Re:Live Presidential Forecast by chc on Wednesday November 09, 2016 @02:11AM (#12906980)
Yes, stop the name-calling or you'll end up like the guy who coined "Lyin' Ted," "Crooked Hillary" and "Little Marco."
Re:Live Presidential Forecast by ant6n on Wednesday November 09, 2016 @02:16AM (#12907020)
Also "Pocahontas"
Re:Live Presidential Forecast by ant6n on Wednesday November 09, 2016 @12:13AM (#12906259)
Sorry, I don't get it. Which part is the name calling?

I also am not sure what you mean by 'fellow citizens' or 'the left'. I'm not American. And Hillary Clinton is not a left candidate, she's centre-right.

Re:Live Presidential Forecast by flukus on Wednesday November 09, 2016 @12:20AM (#12906295)
The racist part was the name calling. The post overall sounded derisive.

The people your criticizing want job security, not lynchings.

Re:Live Presidential Forecast by ant6n on Wednesday November 09, 2016 @12:36AM (#12906393)
Are you saying Trump is not a racist? Are you saying that it's not true that many Trump supporters are openly racist? Are you saying this is not racism: https://twitter.com/SRowntreeNews/status/796141495573155840 ?

Calling somebody out as racist is not name-calling if it's true.

I feel like the US has become this bizarre place where it's okay to be racist and sexist, but if you call people out for it you're the bad guy.

Re:Live Presidential Forecast by flukus on Wednesday November 09, 2016 @12:49AM (#12906493)
Many are, but so are many (assumed) Clinton supporters:

http://thefederalist.com/2016/10/27/berkeley-activists-block...

And as I said elsewhere, many of Trumps votes are coming from people that voted for Obama last time. Do you really think they are racist?

Re:Live Presidential Forecast by ant6n on Wednesday November 09, 2016 @12:56AM (#12906536)
(assumed)
Re:Live Presidential Forecast by coderdude on Wednesday November 09, 2016 @12:41AM (#12906428)
Racism and sexism are indeed alive and well: https://hn.algolia.com/?query=white%20male&sort=byPopularity...

The first and second hit are from you, humorously enough.

Re:Live Presidential Forecast by flukus on Wednesday November 09, 2016 @01:06AM (#12906604)
Fivethirtyeight had a funny post earlier today mentions how white males are now voting as a minority block.
Re:Live Presidential Forecast by reitanqild on Wednesday November 09, 2016 @12:51AM (#12906503)
Quoting you:

> (, racist) working class folks

You didn't say Trump was, you tried to smear the whole working class or at least the ones that voted for Trump.

I don't like Trump, I just personally refuse to think that 50% of Americans are stupid racists.

Re:Live Presidential Forecast by ant6n on Wednesday November 09, 2016 @01:09AM (#12906621)
I put the racist in parenthesis, so clearly I don't mean all of them. But I think a lot of the sort of poor/working class Mid-Western people are in fact racist. If you listen to some reports of Trump rallies; or if you listen to how a lot of these people viewed the 'black lives matter' movement, I don't think its inaccurate. Or if you look at the very strong undercurrent of racism that permeates all of the US.

Racism has been shamed for many decades, and Trump made it 'in' again.

Racism was a major issue in this election. The SNL's 'black jeopardy' skit was surprisingly observant in this respect [1]. I didn't expect people on HN to just dismiss it like that. Or completely ignoring an argument about how people cutting their nose to spite their face, because it included the word 'racist'.

It's kind of ironic, like I tickled somebody's PC funny bone, when Trump's campagin was all about the freedom to say whatever you want.

[1] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UUe0xy-yidk

Re:Live Presidential Forecast by RandomOpinion on Wednesday November 09, 2016 @12:21AM (#12906300)
My apologies, I had assumed that you were American.

Since this is a thread on an American presidential election, on the American political spectrum, Mrs. Clinton would be considered to be on the left or center-left.

Re:Live Presidential Forecast by Inconel on Tuesday November 08, 2016 @11:38PM (#12906082)
I imagine at the very least he won't treat them with open contempt and hostility. That probably goes a long way for some of these voters.

I'm not a Trump supporter, but I do live in coastal California, and the absolute derision with which I see relatively privileged, affluent, college educated people treat or talk about the working/rural poor in "flyover" country makes me question whether, despite my current views, I too wouldn't vote Trump if I found myself on the receiving end of such hostility.

Re:Live Presidential Forecast by ant6n on Tuesday November 08, 2016 @11:49PM (#12906124)
> I imagine at the very least he won't treat them with open contempt and hostility

As long as you're white, male, hetero, anti-intelectual, Christian, and not born in another country.

EDIT: it seems that people are really sensitive about being called out for all the hate Trump spews in their name.

Re:Live Presidential Forecast by matwood on Tuesday November 08, 2016 @11:59PM (#12906178)
For starters he didn't walk around calling them uneducated idiots like many on the left have and continue to do.

Bernie and Trump are touching into the same underlying problem that a lot of people have been left behind. They have felt screwed by the system for awhile and this is what we get. Heck, Bernie supporters got screwed again during the primary.

This is also only the start. Wait until we automate all fast food and driving jobs to see what a angry, jobless populace looks like.

Re:Live Presidential Forecast by ant6n on Wednesday November 09, 2016 @12:17AM (#12906281)
Clinton called somebody idiots? I thought she only called Trump an idiot. Which doesn't seem like an unfair assessment.

I mean as far as name-calling goes, I got the impression Hillary is doing almost none of that; whereas Trump was vicious.

Re:Live Presidential Forecast by flukus on Wednesday November 09, 2016 @12:23AM (#12906313)
Remember when she called them a "bag of deplorables"? Not that trump was exactly statesman like, but I don't remember him insulting Clinton supporters, just Clinton herself.
Re:Live Presidential Forecast by ant6n on Wednesday November 09, 2016 @02:18AM (#12907034)
“You know, to just be grossly generalistic, you could put half of Trump’s supporters into what I call the basket of deplorables. Right?

“The racist, sexist, homophobic, xenophobic, Islamaphobic – you name it. And unfortunately, there are people like that. And he has lifted them up.

“Some of those folks,” she added, “they are irredeemable.”

Re:Live Presidential Forecast by Mathnerd314 on Wednesday November 09, 2016 @12:25AM (#12906323)
Trump has words ("the best words"). The words will inspire Congress to pass laws. The laws will (in theory) help the people. Trump will continue traveling around the country, and report back to Congress what is or is not working.

Beyond that it's difficult to say, Trump has promised little but hinted at a lot.

Re:Live Presidential Forecast by basch on Wednesday November 09, 2016 @12:19AM (#12906290)
for lack of better terms, relevantly speaking, doesnt collapsing robber baron portfolios reduce wealth inequality?