I blame things like instant messaging for making those baseline friendship interactions too easy and too disposable and too convenient.

My response is to get out there and I socialise anyway. If someone makes efforts to be friendly to me I man the fuck up and return in kind and I recognise the way I feel for the fault that it is. It's a dead end that leads to unhappiness. Hanging out with people (not just your friends, ANYONE) is like exercise for your mental health. The more you hate and dread it the more you probably need it so it's best to just get it over with because it'll become easier with renewed practise.

I've tried to force myself to socialise, but I always leave early (I cannot bear it), stressed and sweating through my blazer armpits, and just happy to leave the occasion.

Family seems so much more important to me now, and only somewhat stressful.

I guess I'm an introvert. I don't think that's ever going to change, and I've come to accept it. I lose energy when I'm with strangers. I don't want to do that anymore unless it is absolutely necessary.

Also, I am happy. I do not feel lonely. I may also be a bit of a hermit.

uh, you're sweating and freaking out when you're interacting with people. that isn't introversion, that's social anxiety or some other undiagnosed condition.

Socializing with strangers is boring and stressful, and I choose not to do it if possible. I don't feel like this is a condition that needs to be diagnosed and fixed :)

Of course, I'm not a trained psychologist and neither are you probably, so neither of us are qualified to say either way.

But the things you described are meaningful. Watching movies, playing games, and spending precious time doing "pointless" things are what life is about, in a sense. No one wants to hang out with someone who makes them feel worthless, that their mere companionship is a waste of time. Maybe take a step back and realize that other supposedly less interesting people are actually very interesting in their own ways. That is, assuming you want friends.

I thought that the point was that he didn't.

I've just come to realize my fundamental incompatibility with most of the people who I considered friends in the past. That doesn't mean that I feel I'm better than them in any way, just that we're not compatible.

So I'd rather just be by myself -- as, except in my darkest moods, I'm pretty compatible with myself.

That doesn't mean that I don't ever crave a deep, meaningful connection with others, and I have achieved that (though very rarely) before, but as I'm not very social, that's pretty hard for me to do.. not to mention that there are always prices to pay (from time and effort invested in finding/cultivating the relationship, to the pain and suffering when it ends, privacy/independence costs, etc), so most of the time I really don't want to bother. So much easier and safer to just curl up by myself with a good book in the evening.

Friendship as a word had more meaning before the advent of social media. Now it's become depersonalized: followers, Facebook/Instagram friends, Snapchat followers, Tinder pseudo-relationships, etc.

I've found the walled gardens to be the main problem. When I hopped on my Pentium II with my 28.8k modem, I met some of the most interesting people in the world. I still communicate with some to this day, but it's harder and harder to discover new friendships past a certain age.

I'd say your solution might be found in a different environment - perhaps a different state or country?

As for moving, I've done that many times in my life. I've found that for me, unless I already know somebody in the place I'm moving to, and can meet people through them, I have a very difficult time making new friends. And there's virtually no one I know well anywhere any more.

I think what it ultimately boils down to is not being very social to begin with, combined with some social phobia, with mostly non-mainstream interests, and being content enough with my own company most of the time. That's lead to a lifetime of habits and choices that have resulted in the withering of my friendships the lack of enough motivation to make much effort to get new ones.

Most of the time I don't even think about it, and when I do, I just wonder why I should bother, as my attempts usually lead to nothing or just more pain and suffering.

It doesn't help that the people I'd probably have the most in common with probably aren't very social themselves and have problems making friends too.

Social media is no substitute for meaningful interaction, but does anyone actually think it is? It's a nice middle ground between having someone important and involved in your life and hardly communicating with them at all; just because I don't want/can't maintain the former with someone doesn't mean I want the latter.

Tinder's a weird one to group in there, since it's geared towards meeting new people, not keeping up with your friends.

Also

> You can never truly connect with people anymore

Why not? You can still go outside and talk to people.

What do you mean by this, specifically? I've wrestled with the idea of finding people I have more "in common with," but I've ended up at a place where I think the idea of "best friends" is kind of an overblown myth, or at least it's a LOT rarer than people think it is. What's the fun in hanging out with someone who's the same as you, anyway?

I'm come to realize that, while I tend to think I'm losing touch with old friends because "we don't have a lot in common anymore," it's far more often just because one or both of us is being a shitty friend and the relationship isn't giving enough satisfaction in return to continue investing in maintaining it for one or both parties.

>how rarely we talked about or did anything that was really meaningful for me

But really, if you always did "meaningful" things and always had "meaningful" conversations with your friends, then nothing would actually stand out as "meaningful." Maybe there are other reasons to converse and hang out with people than finding deep meaning in everything. Most people seeking out that deeper "meaning" tend to have to find it for themselves, they don't just discover a perfect group of like-minded individuals who can evoke the meaning of life from their deep, intellectual conversations with each other.

>sometimes I notice some couples or groups of friends around me, having fun, laughing together, and it bothers me

I think this is sort of a social darwinism version of the imposter syndrome. It seems so easy when you see a group of people laughing together. It seems like they just effortlessly entertain each other, but nobody sees the inner workings behind the scenes. Nobody sees the fact that Jenny secretly hates Stacy, but hides it because the group is fun to hang out with and Stacy is always there, or that Steve is dating Brian's ex and Brian says it's fine but really secretly hates it, etc...

This idea where you see couples or groups of people who just seem to effortlessly get along, and it seems like they aren't even trying is totally false. Sure, there are people for whom social skills come far more naturally, but relationships of any kind take effort by both parties to maintain and grow.

Most of my strongest friendships have tended to happen with people who share some of the same core values that I do but who are fundamentally different than me in other ways. This makes the relationship very rewarding as every conversation is a potential learning or growth opportunity for both parties.

Well, I guess I can elaborate a bit. I have a bunch of obscure interests, and most people haven't even heard of them, much less share them or are nearly as interested in them as I am. I used to be ok with that, and would hang out with people who would want to talk about and do things that I have absolutely no interest in, but after a while I realized that I was wasting my time doing that.

I'd rather just spend the time by myself, reading about, learning, or doing things that I was interested in. One thing I take great refuge in is reading old books by or about truly great authors and people, and they're always interested in and talk about exactly the things I am interested in, simply because I choose to read only those books which are about what I'm interested in (or am open to becoming interested in).

From time to time, I've joined clubs or gone to meetups of people who are interested in one of the things that I am interested in, but then it's rare for them to be interested in the other obscure things I'm interested in. And I guess that's where I get too picky for my own good, as there's really little chance of finding people who share all or even a significant fraction of the obscure stuff I'm interested in.

Not that it has to be all about common interests. If I could somehow make a deep connection with someone I could see myself getting interested in some of the things they were interested in, or vice-versa. But that's hard to do if you don't already have something in common to begin with.

As to your point about what's happening behind the scenes of a superficially happy looking group of people, I recognize that it may not (and probably isn't) quite as idyllic as it looks on the surface, and that recognition gives me even less reason to seek companionship with other people. There's often a lot of pain and effort involved, and for me it's just not worth it. It's so much easier and simpler to just stay my own best (and only) friend.

I think it's remarkably important to surround yourself with people that are meaningful to you; that to me is different from things in common. Having things in common helps provide a medium for bonding but it's rarely the specific activity that is the focus for bonding, it's the shared experience that is.

There are lots of people that I call friends with whom I have little in-common, but there's a specific experience I've had with them or perhaps one specific thing to bond over that has created a strong connection.

Meaningful conversation is important too but I often find that trying to have a conversation I want to have can be productive. Many people are actually very interested in different ways of thinking or approaching life.

You are completely justified in your solitude. As you said, it works for you. Yet I still believe meaningful connections (and personal growth) are abound without superficiality if you are willing to give it time and effort.

...Sometimes I believe it is the disparity between myself and another that leads to a lasting, meaningful connection more so than the similarity.

I'm married and my wife has gone through a similar transformation. We're also fairly introverted, in the sense that social situations leave us feeling tired afterwards. The funny thing is that time together is like being alone: it isn't exhausting.

I'm an introvert, I spend the vast majority of my time with my wife. I rarely talk to others at work, and I almost never comment or interact with anyone on social media. Talking to people in any medium is exhausting.

If so, maybe you should try just being yourself around other people too.

The downside is that deeper friendships take longer to form, but for this introvert, that's fine.

I think the relevant parts are toward the beginning. Full thing's worth listening to, several times. Or you could just read Infinite Jest.

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=FkxUY0kxH80

Particularly around 18 and 24 minutes, continuing for 6-10 minutes after. Ah yes, particularly at 30m.

The theme is interwoven throughought the interview though.

More recently, there are books like The Lonely Crowd from the 1960's, [2] and Anthony Storr's Solitude, from the 1980's[3]

Of course, for thousands of years, spending time in solitude has been greatly valued for religious reasons, for "building character", for coming in touch with oneself, or for creative purposes. On the other hand, modern life, and more recently the media (even before social media) have been criticized for alienating people from themselves and from each other.

[1] - http://www.hermitary.com/solitude/montaigne.html

[2] - https://www.amazon.com/Lonely-Crowd-Changing-Character-Paper...

[3] - https://www.amazon.com/Solitude-Return-Self-Anthony-Storr/dp...

I seem to recall a title "Solitude and the Self", though I can't find it via Worldcat. There's a similar one from the right timeframe: https://www.worldcat.org/title/solitude-a-return-to-the-self...

Arguably Chiksentmihilyi's work on Flow involves this too.

I think the truth is much more simple. Most people are not highly critical of introverts that prefer quiet and solitude. They may not understand it, but they are mostly indifferent. However, the harsh struggle for the introvert to connect with others on a deeper level leads him/her to that conclusion.

Many times I catch myself thinking about contacting some of my old friends or some people I got to know the latter years, to do something more than the usual stuff I get to do with my girlfriend, but I don't.

I haven't figured out if I'm the picky b@st@srd or my "friends" and people I know are the issue.

It's a bit like having your life's savings only in stocks of your employer.

For me, being in the same situation, my partner is often more company than I need or want. And I only see them on weekends.

Just to check, have you found this to be important to you through experience or are you just sort of assuming that meaning is important? Those groups and couples aren't really doing anything meaningful. They're just hanging out with each other because it's fun.

If you're experiencing envy of people just hanging out and having fun then maybe your goals and your wants aren't aligned as well as they could be.

I assume that young people are instinctively expanding their social networks in search of mates. Older people do that too -- but it is less vitally imporant.