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Re:Yahoo misses profit expectations in what could be its las... by dexwiz on Monday July 18, 2016 @11:04PM (#12119282)
Has there ever been a successful turnaround of a software company of Yahoo's scale? Mayer has been tech news' pinata for over a year now, but the company was sliding before she was even hired. Looking through a list of dead Yahoo services, it reads as an obituary of region specific social networking sites and forgettable web services[1]. Social sites are notoriously fickle, and boosting one to popularity is somewhat of a dark art. Web services are a dime a dozen, and Google or Facebook probably has a better one. Yahoo seemed like it failed to break into any enterprise offerings either.

Poor leadership, and failure to attract talent. They didn't have the same culture pull as Google/Facebook/Apple in the latest tech bubble. And why work for Yahoo if you could do the same thing with VCs funneling you money? I think one of the most telling things is the lack of OSS from Yahoo. Their top repo on github has been effectively dead for around a year [2]. Yahoo hasn't been a tech company is almost a decade, and it shows in their products. Not even their numerous acquihires have netted them anything.

EDIT: Looking at a timeline of Yahoo, they haven't launched a major product since 2006 (10 years). All new products have been bought [3]. Imagine if Google's last product was Docs. No Android, no Doubleclick, no Street View, no autocomplete in search, no Chrome.

[1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Yahoo!-owned_sites_and...

[2] https://github.com/search?o=desc&q=user%3Ayahoo&ref=searchre...

[3] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Timeline_of_Yahoo!#2006

Re:Yahoo misses profit expectations in what could be its las... by cpeterso on Monday July 18, 2016 @11:41PM (#12119428)
> Imagine if Google's last product was Docs. No Android, no Doubleclick, no Street View, no autocomplete in search, no Chrome.

Android, DoubleClick, Google Maps (Where 2, ZipDash), Google Earth (Keyhole), and Google Docs (Writely, 2Web, Tonic, DocVerse, Quickoffice) were built of acquisitions, not new Google products. Chrome, too, in a sense (WebKit).

Thought experiment: what if Yahoo!, not Google, had acquired all those companies instead?

Re:Yahoo misses profit expectations in what could be its las... by tuxracer on Tuesday July 19, 2016 @01:33AM (#12119950)
Re:Yahoo misses profit expectations in what could be its las... by carterehsmith on Tuesday July 19, 2016 @12:08AM (#12119561)
They _did_ buy Tumblr and all you ever read about that is Yahoo writing off more of the Tumblr value.

How are their other acquisitions doing?

Re:Yahoo misses profit expectations in what could be its las... by fheisler on Tuesday July 19, 2016 @08:16AM (#12121257)
Re:Yahoo misses profit expectations in what could be its las... by douche on Tuesday July 19, 2016 @12:03AM (#12119534)
I wonder if I'd be using a Samsung WP10 model, instead of a Galaxy, still using Firefox, and using the Office365 suite. Maybe MapQuest, again.
Re:Yahoo misses profit expectations in what could be its las... by nostromo on Monday July 18, 2016 @11:10PM (#12119309)
Apple, of course. It's probably the biggest turn-around story of our time.
Re:Yahoo misses profit expectations in what could be its las... by ams6110 on Monday July 18, 2016 @11:14PM (#12119326)
Apple turned around by moving much more heavily into consumer hardware, specifically the iPod and then the iPhone and iPad. It was not really a software turnaround, though that was a smaller part of it.
Re:Yahoo misses profit expectations in what could be its las... by lsc on Tuesday July 19, 2016 @12:40AM (#12119712)
was it, though? I mean, none of the apple hardware is amazing, and today, it's not even really different, but... the software mostly works, and for computers? that's amazing.

I remember in the mid aughts, when I had been working exclusively with linux for some time, I started to see my peers, peers who wouldn't be caught dead with a windows laptop, carrying around os-x laptops.

Compared to the ThinkPad of the day, the macbooks were terrible pieces of hardware; they were obviously designed by people who believed in style over substance, and their keyboard was mush. But... OS-X? OS-X mostly worked, something that could not be said for windows or linux laptops, not without a whole lot of effort.

Re:Yahoo misses profit expectations in what could be its las... by neotek on Tuesday July 19, 2016 @03:53AM (#12120444)
Pretty much all of Apple's hardware is amazing. If you try and evaluate them on specs alone then sure, they fall short - less RAM in their phones, slower clock speeds, whatever - but the vast majority of people don't buy hardware because of its technical specs, they buy hardware because it looks gorgeous, makes them feel special, and performs the tasks they need it to perform. Nobody ever lined up for a week to buy a ThinkPad.
Re:Yahoo misses profit expectations in what could be its las... by chansecodina on Tuesday July 19, 2016 @01:42PM (#12123326)
The key part phrase there is "[c]ompared to the ThinkPad of the day". IMHO, MacBooks and ThinkPads were nowhere near comparable in build quality until the the MacBooks went to unibody aluminum construction.
Re:Yahoo misses profit expectations in what could be its las... by lsc on Wednesday July 20, 2016 @03:16AM (#12127366)
and they were only comparable then because lenovo seems bent on cheapening the ThinkPad.
Re:Yahoo misses profit expectations in what could be its las... by deviate_X on Tuesday July 19, 2016 @07:55AM (#12121177)
I would say that it pretty clear the iPod completely turned Apple around, but importantly it was the excellent execution in the social space, on the software front and follow through with the iPhone (new hardware), this is a rare event and is what differentiates the Apple of that time from other companies which have had a breakthrough product.
Re:Yahoo misses profit expectations in what could be its las... by estefan on Tuesday July 19, 2016 @08:36AM (#12121335)
Actually the first thing Jobs did upon his return was to cut the product line and focus. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9GMQhOm-Dqo
Re:Yahoo misses profit expectations in what could be its las... by _b8r0 on Tuesday July 19, 2016 @07:40AM (#12121129)
I'd say Apple turned around by moving into media distribution rather than hardware. The iTunes and App stores are massive revenue generators for Apple.
Re:Yahoo misses profit expectations in what could be its las... by the_duke on Tuesday July 19, 2016 @11:10AM (#12122205)
Apple was already doing well before the iPod with iTunes and later the iPhone and app store came along.

The turn around happened before.

Re:Yahoo misses profit expectations in what could be its las... by dredmorbius on Monday July 18, 2016 @11:16PM (#12119333)
Hardware.
Re:Yahoo misses profit expectations in what could be its las... by dailo10 on Tuesday July 19, 2016 @10:05AM (#12121829)
Regarding OSS - Yahoo was behind Hadoop, the platform for big data and distributed computing. HBase, Spark, Storm, etc. are all built on top of Hadoop. Gotta give them credit for that one.
Re:Yahoo misses profit expectations in what could be its las... by cdibona on Tuesday July 19, 2016 @11:47AM (#12122405)
Sure, but Doug started that at Yahoo some 12 years ago now... I don't relish Yahoo's demise, but Hadoop isn't a great example of recent yahoo innovation....
Re:Yahoo misses profit expectations in what could be its las... by tomc1985 on Tuesday July 19, 2016 @12:29AM (#12119665)
That's harsh. There are a handful of top-notch products with great features that I would really like to see stay around in their current form. (Yahoo Finance and Flickr come to mind.)

Plus, while they are what they are now, you can't necessarily deny open-source contributions in the past. YUI is impressive in its scope, for one.

Re:Yahoo misses profit expectations in what could be its las... by jldugger on Monday July 18, 2016 @11:08PM (#12119296)
> Has there ever been a successful turnaround of a software company of Yahoo's scale?

Intel and IBM come to mind.

Re:Yahoo misses profit expectations in what could be its las... by acchow on Monday July 18, 2016 @11:24PM (#12119359)
I think Intel is mostly hardware and IBM is mostly consulting?
Re:Yahoo misses profit expectations in what could be its las... by msh on Tuesday July 19, 2016 @04:12AM (#12120507)
The IBM turn around was turning them into a consulting company.

Might not be the most glamorous turn around but compared to yahoo...

Re:Yahoo misses profit expectations in what could be its las... by AlisdairO on Tuesday July 19, 2016 @04:31AM (#12120563)
IBM has a large consulting arm (although it is shrinking IIRC), but they also still have an enormous software business that brings in many billions in profit every year. Hardware is shrinking but still pretty damn big.
Re:Yahoo misses profit expectations in what could be its las... by dexwiz on Monday July 18, 2016 @11:12PM (#12119320)
Neither of which are software companies. That is to say they offer hardware and services.
Re:Yahoo misses profit expectations in what could be its las... by dredmorbius on Monday July 18, 2016 @11:21PM (#12119346)
There are very few pure-play software companies.

Microsoft is simply alone in its class as a large, pure-play, shrinkwrap software company. Adobe might come close.

IBM, Oracle, SAS, PWC, Deloitte, McKinsey, PeopleSoft, and many other firms bundled software with at the very least consulting services. IBM, along with Sun, HP, Digital, and other vendors sold (or leased) both hardware and software, along with consulting services.

Smaller software companies have existed, but have been notoriously fickle.

Novell existed as a network services company, doing well for a while, but ultimately faltering.

EDS is probably the closest thing to a precursor to today's SaaS / XaaS companies, and was ultimately in the services business and bought by HP IIRC.

I've been looking at this question for nearly two decades, and the most substantive conclusion I've come to was that Microsoft was a unicorn, a lone star, a singleton. And yet everyone's tried to emulated them. Or at least did until Google came along and cracked a different market.

Re:Yahoo misses profit expectations in what could be its las... by kalleboo on Tuesday July 19, 2016 @12:22AM (#12119639)
I would have used Microsoft as an example of a former software company that has started banking on hardware (Xbox, Surface, Nokia)
Re:Yahoo misses profit expectations in what could be its las... by dredmorbius on Tuesday July 19, 2016 @02:12AM (#12120087)
AFAIK the vast bulk of Microsoft's revenue continues to come from software: OS, Office, and Server products. I've not seen a breakdown for some time.

Microsoft have been trying to get out of this for quite some time. Back when I worked for a very large revolving credit transactions processor, the stated goal was to get into the online payments game (this nearly 20 years ago now). Microsoft Passport was among the products aimed at this effort, which ultimately failed, attributed by many at the time with the lack of trust any other business had at getting in bed with Microsoft standing on their revenue stream.

Re:Yahoo misses profit expectations in what could be its las... by awad on Tuesday July 19, 2016 @04:48AM (#12120617)
This list of billion dollar lines of business at Microsoft was generated in 2013 but let's go with the safe assumption that from 2013 they doubled down on the software components (which they did) and kind of lukewarm accepted the other parts of the business:

Windows (which also, up until now, included Surface, which contributed $853 million to the total in fiscal 2013)

Windows Server

Windows Azure

Office (client)

Xbox

SQL Server

System Center (client and server both, so includes Windows Intune)

SharePoint

Visual Studio

Dynamics (CRM and ERP)

Online Advertising (search and display both) Office 365

Client-access license (CAL) suites (formerly known as desktop access)

Enterprise Services (including consulting)

Enterprise communication business (Exchange plus Lync)

[http://www.zdnet.com/article/microsofts-16-billion-dollar-bu...]

Not too bad, eh?

Re:Yahoo misses profit expectations in what could be its las... by douche on Tuesday July 19, 2016 @06:17AM (#12120885)
Azure and Office 365 have to be an even bigger portion of this now than then. The number of companies moving to Office 365 for their Exchange and Office usage is enormous. Millions and millions of seats, at $5-10 per month per seat (or more), adds up quickly.
Re:Yahoo misses profit expectations in what could be its las... by FT_intern on Tuesday July 19, 2016 @01:23AM (#12119901)
Aren't those products loss leaders for the purpose of eventually making money off of software (games fall in this category)/consulting services?
Re:Yahoo misses profit expectations in what could be its las... by dexwiz on Monday July 18, 2016 @11:25PM (#12119364)
That is a good point. Google is also a hardware company, they just didn't sell any of it until recently (App Engine/Cloud).
Re:Yahoo misses profit expectations in what could be its las... by dredmorbius on Monday July 18, 2016 @11:46PM (#12119451)
Google generate revenue through advertising, and more of that by locking up the advertising networks and market than through user data.

They also have exceptionally good technical execution on backbone infrastructure. I'm impressed by how good they are, I really am. As well as at not fucking up upgrades to software that runs on top of that.

But their understanding of, and attitudes toward, end users really, really, really stinks. Perhaps not massively worse than the rest of the industry, but certainly no better.

Re:Yahoo misses profit expectations in what could be its las... by patmcguire on Monday July 18, 2016 @11:23PM (#12119354)
No, but software companies of Yahoo's scale are either established within the past 20 years or Microsoft. That doesn't give a lot of time for things to go great, then get well and truly fucked, and then come back from the brink.
Re:Yahoo misses profit expectations in what could be its las... by jonknee on Tuesday July 19, 2016 @12:35AM (#12119692)
> Has there ever been a successful turnaround of a software company of Yahoo's scale?

Is Yahoo a software company? They don't claim to be (I think it's currently a media company).

Re:Yahoo misses profit expectations in what could be its las... by hkmurakami on Monday July 18, 2016 @11:43PM (#12119437)
Does Redhat count?
Re:Yahoo misses profit expectations in what could be its las... by ghaff on Tuesday July 19, 2016 @03:28AM (#12120335)
Red Hat has been consistently successful since it's been a company of any appreciable scale so it's not an example of a turnaround of a (moderately) big software company.