Re:TTIP Leaks
by ekianjo on Monday May 02, 2016 @11:13AM
(#11612005)
Ever considered that internal combustion engines actually also saved lives (and made life possible in places where it was not) ? Let's not paint the world black and white.
[ Parent
| on HN ]
Yes, but that has nothing to do with diesel fuel vs. others, which was the point of the previous two comments.
Honestly, where has it made life possible where it was not?
Most places have been inhabited for eons, or settled before the invention of the internal combustion engine.
Honestly, please report back with a plan that gets the USA from 30 million people in 1860 to 300+ million people today without using the internal combustion engine.
or freed (cumulatively) billions from backbreaking labor.
Re:TTIP Leaks
by odonnellryan on Monday May 02, 2016 @02:17PM
(#11613963)
This is more important. Also, transporting people when they'd die/have horrible conditions otherwise.
I think it is a silly argument to say it helped people by helping them exist in the first place. It is a weird argument for a larger population, which probably isn't a great thing.
> larger population [...] probably isn't a great thing.
Julian Simon would have strongly disagreed and he put his money where his mouth was in his famous bets with Erlich: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Julian_Simon
Re:TTIP Leaks
by odonnellryan on Monday May 02, 2016 @03:34PM
(#11614767)
Yes, but he actually got lucky. Given the average of any 10-year period in the last 100 years I believe Simon would have been wrong.
Re:TTIP Leaks
by jessaustin on Monday May 02, 2016 @09:22PM
(#11617159)
It might not have been Simon's good luck, because Erlich's luck when it comes to prediction has been consistently bad.
Can you show some data online to back that up? I'm genuinely curious.
Yes, I was talking about that.
But if you want an answer, many of the first cars were electric, if they went with the electric engine instead things wouldn't be exactly the same, but would have allowed the US to increase to 300+ million no problem.
I'm sure the electric planes, tanks and aircraft carriers would've made for some interesting historical footnotes in 1939. Assuming we hadn't already all starved due to the lack of food being produced by the electric farm tractors.
You may have starved. Everyone else would have continued to rely on the steam tractors that were in use well into the 30s. I'm sure most aircraft carriers would be powered the same way nuclear subs are powered now.
Ah yes. Wake up a few extra hours before sunrise to load crisp, clean-burning coal into a furnace. Then fiddle with dials waiting for it to come up to pressure without exploding. Then drag a cast iron boiler and tons of water (!) on tiny wheels across muddy fields, generating 15 horsepower. Built to scale!
generating 15 horsepower
You don't need a lot of horsepower to replace a horse. Quite literally, one would be enough.
In the spring you have a specific number of weeks to prep and plant. The amount of food you can produce is directly tied to the horsepower you can apply. It's also the difference between spending 15 hours a day in the field versus 8.
Yeah, I know, more power means you can process a bigger swath of the field faster with one pass. But I've driven a ~15hp tractor, and it could still do a lot more than you'd think.
You're clearly a waste of time. They were already doing that.
Why? Because the ICE's weren't up to snuff.
(replying to soperj's sibling post)
> Honestly, where has it made life possible where it was not?
Antarctica!
But yeah, I think the parent was just making a point :P
Re:TTIP Leaks
by rorykoehler on Tuesday May 03, 2016 @04:02AM
(#11618760)
Hard drugs make the pain go away but they also slowly kill you.