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Re:The Curse of the Pixar Universe by wrsh07 on Friday June 26, 2015 @05:55PM (#9787990)
Maybe the critic is too cerebral for me [mentioning Malick etc], but I think I missed the point.
Re:The Curse of the Pixar Universe by Jare on Friday June 26, 2015 @06:54PM (#9788221)
I haven't seen the movie, but what the article says resonated with the vibes I got from the trailers, so...

> The wonder of childhood is the opposite of the cozy vision of “Inside Out”

That may be a key quote. Kids movies, and Pixar movies (which often are, or used to be, for adults as much as for kids) don't need to contain simplistic world views; they need simple and layered presentation, but the world may be rich, and the characters and situations be driven by nuanced and sophisticated themes under the colourful hood. Toy Story 2, The Incredibles and Frozen, in my opinion, are shining examples.

Re:The Curse of the Pixar Universe by PirateDave on Friday June 26, 2015 @06:17PM (#9788076)
I got the same feeling; I'm not sure what movie the reviewer thought he was going into, but it feels like he was expecting a David Lynch film or something similar, not a simple kid's movie.
Re:The Curse of the Pixar Universe by icebraining on Friday June 26, 2015 @07:10PM (#9788270)
I wouldn't say he expected any different; I think he just loathes the fact that these "kid's movies" are, as you called them, simple, or better yet, simplistic.

He thinks the movie does a disservice to kids by presenting what is, in his opinion, a distorted and sugar-coated representation of mental life and motivations.

Essentially, he thinks that a good movie would pass to viewers what Malick's Tree of Life does about the inner life of children (feelings of wonder, the need to act out for its own sake, the deception ones does for others and even oneself, etc) in a way that would appeal to kids.

(By the way, this is just what I understood from the review; I haven't seen Inside Out)

Re:The Curse of the Pixar Universe by anigbrowl on Friday June 26, 2015 @07:01PM (#9788238)
I think it's especially important to analyze kids' movies because of their significant ideological impact. You cant ell effective kids; stories without dumbing things down. I found it a very interesting analysis.
Re:The Curse of the Pixar Universe by icebraining on Friday June 26, 2015 @07:15PM (#9788283)
You can't tell effective kids' stories without dumbing things down.

Isn't that exactly what he disagrees with, though? I think he's looking for a director that can tell a kids' story, and show the shape of the inner mind, without having to dumb things down.

It's a tall order - he says it would require a director of genius - but I think his point is that if a director needs to dumb things down to make a film for kids, (s)he's better off not doing it at all.

Re:The Curse of the Pixar Universe by rufus_t on Friday June 26, 2015 @07:52PM (#9788408)
I believe "You cant ell" was meant to be "You can tell", not "You can't tell", and that you agree with each other.
Re:The Curse of the Pixar Universe by anigbrowl on Saturday June 27, 2015 @02:22AM (#9789306)
Yes, I didn't have time to proofread and missed the mistake. Sorry for the confusion!
Re:The Curse of the Pixar Universe by icebraining on Friday June 26, 2015 @08:12PM (#9788472)
Oh, I think you're right. Never mind, then :)
Re:The Curse of the Pixar Universe by dennisnedry on Friday June 26, 2015 @06:27PM (#9788115)
That's the problem with critics, they get paid to analyze things. Sometimes things don't really need to be analyzed, just taken at face value.
Re:The Curse of the Pixar Universe by 2muchcoffeeman on Friday June 26, 2015 @06:37PM (#9788166)
I think understanding when a movie is just for fun is part of a film critics job.

In Australia we used to have Margaret and David before they recently retired. They were really good film critics with tastes that covered a large spectrum of movies.

Re:The Curse of the Pixar Universe by icebraining on Friday June 26, 2015 @07:33PM (#9788345)
On the other hand, there's "Man Getting Hit By Football"[1]. One can find a film too simplistic to be appreciated even if one takes it as "just for fun".

As people whose work is very subjective, critics don't lend themselves to be read in an ad-hoc fashion, in my opinion. One should follow their reviews, compare them with the works one has also watched/read, and only then decide which critics are more appropriate for you.

[1] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mV1LWhNpTJU

Re:The Curse of the Pixar Universe by huu on Friday June 26, 2015 @07:45PM (#9788386)
"The very notion of what’s appropriate for children looms over any consideration of a movie intended for children."

This is the author's justification for why he's critiquing the film. I disagree, personally, because he himself is not a child. I doubt any child would enjoy "The Tree of Life".

Re:The Curse of the Pixar Universe by icebraining on Friday June 26, 2015 @09:59PM (#9788768)
I don't think the author expects children to enjoy The Tree of Life; I think he just believes it's possible (if difficult) to write a film for children without losing its subtlety.
Re:The Curse of the Pixar Universe by Jimmy on Friday June 26, 2015 @06:29PM (#9788124)
Before I clicked on the comments, I had a suspicion that this article wouldn't resonate with the HN crowd. It's very much an example of "humanities" thinking.
Re:The Curse of the Pixar Universe by 2muchcoffeeman on Friday June 26, 2015 @06:33PM (#9788144)
Honest question, what does that mean?
Re:The Curse of the Pixar Universe by GuiA on Friday June 26, 2015 @07:11PM (#9788271)
Can't speak for 'Jimmy, but here's my interpretation of what he's saying:

The HN crowd typically comes from a very analytical, scientific background. This line of thinking is based on deriving ideas and concepts from one another based on first order logic, empirical evidence, and reproducible experiments. This is a great way to build accurate models of the world, and allows us to build cars, satellites, computers, grow food crops efficiently, and a myriad other wonderful things.

By contrast, humanities thinking is about accepting that things can be approached and analyzed from multiple angles, using a variety of ideas, frameworks, and concepts that might be at odds with one another but all still give us valuable insights into whatever it is we're studying. This is a great way to approach things like art, human emotions, raising children, and a myriad other wonderful things.

Each approach has its place, and being able to use either in daily life is probably a good skill to have. If an algorithm is incorrect, you fix it - trying to argue that an incorrect algorithm holds as much value as a correct one probably isn't going to get you anywhere. On the other hand, there isn't such a thing as a mathematical function to clearly define what love or a beautiful piece of art is - trying to define such a function probably isn't going to get you anywhere.

To tie it back within the context of the original post: the vast majority of critics loved the new Pixar movie, and it seems to be a wonderful movie in the cultural context of 2015. But humanities thinking tells us that there is value in taking the movie apart and criticizing it in the way that the article's author is doing. Not because he's reaching an objective, unique, true conclusion - but because there's inherent value in that process, and in taking a stance opposed to the mainstream consensus. It might give one new ways to think about analyzing movies, or put words on some slight discomfort one had while watching the movie even if one enjoyed it, or heighten one's enjoyment of the movie, or any number of other things.

Re:The Curse of the Pixar Universe by ci5er on Friday June 26, 2015 @07:34PM (#9788347)
That was ... delightful, lucid, and incredibly genteel towards the wearers of both sets of lenses.

As an old-school liberal education, new-school engineering type, I (personally) bristle at some of these critiques. You handled it quite deftly.

This did not need to be a public comment, but I don't know how to PM here, so ... there we are.

EDIT: By "these critiques", I meant the article that ... might not resonate with the HN crowd.

Re:The Curse of the Pixar Universe by pygy_ on Friday June 26, 2015 @08:14PM (#9788481)
FYI, there are no PMs on HN, but thanking someone (being civil in general) is most welcome.
Re:The Curse of the Pixar Universe by iamcreasy on Saturday June 27, 2015 @12:18AM (#9789081)
Excellent. It's just like what Donald Knuth said, "Don't believe something is good just because it's trendy. I'd probably go the other extreme way. If I find too many people adopting a certain idea, I'd probably think its wrong." Source : https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=75Ju0eM5T2c

I've always find those questions that are generally regarded as stupid party amusing. Because I think those questions showing the difference in out thought process, and instead of stigmatizing it there are valuable lessons to be learned here.

Re:The Curse of the Pixar Universe by GuiA on Friday June 26, 2015 @07:30PM (#9788337)
Malick is the director for "The Tree of Life", another movie about a child's inner life that the author contrasts "Inside Out" to in the article.