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Re:Apple – Live – September 2014 Special Event by Aardwolf on Tuesday September 09, 2014 @12:07PM (#8290864)
This website says that live streaming requires OS X or iOS.

Why would they only allow already-customers to watch their presentation?

Locking out non-customers seems not the best way to get some.

Re:Apple – Live – September 2014 Special Event by arrrg on Tuesday September 09, 2014 @12:12PM (#8290900)
Because it ultimately doesn’t matter. Those who really want to watch it already have some device that can play it and the rest doesn’t care about it anyway so much to watch a 2hr commercial and will just read about it somewhere or see it on TV later. I think it’s as simple as that. That’s why Apple doesn’t really try to make this work for as many people as possible.
Re:Apple – Live – September 2014 Special Event by bla2 on Tuesday September 09, 2014 @12:11PM (#8290894)
They probably use https://developer.apple.com/streaming/ , an HTTP streaming mechanism that's implemented by Safari that didn't get adopted by any other browser.
Re:Apple – Live – September 2014 Special Event by MCRed on Tuesday September 09, 2014 @12:17PM (#8290944)
Ever since Apple originated consumer computer video with Quicktime back in the early 1990s, they've done a great deal to make it better, first for CD Roms and in a proprietary fashion. But when the net came around they opened up their proprietary format to become a standard-- the Mpeg4 file format is the old MOV format. They've also proposed a lot of improvements along these lines for other people to adopt.

Like Bonjour, I really don't understand why other companies don't adopt these open standards. They don't benefit Apple particularly. It's not like Apple has some competitive advantage in HTTP Live Streaming. Meanwhile these competitors rush to copy everything else Apple does.

Frankly, I think its appalling that youtube, for instance, is still running on flash. How many years ago did they first trial MP4 streaming? Why I can't I access all the videos over MP4?

Why would you want your browser to be bad at streaming video?

Re:Apple – Live – September 2014 Special Event by Someone1234 on Tuesday September 09, 2014 @12:50PM (#8291160)
None of those things are open standards. Both Mpeg4 and "Bonjour" require a licence to utilise. Maybe that answers your question, people don't want to pay Apple oodles of money?

> Frankly, I think its appalling that youtube, for instance, is still running on flash.

Everyone can turn on HTML5 for YouTube if they wish. They offer both. They give you the choice, the default is Flash (but Flash still has the widest support on older platforms).

> Why I can't I access all the videos over MP4?

Because people would have to pay licensing fees several times for the same stream (e.g. sender and receiver both have to pay $$$, sometimes the sender, browser vendor AND OS vendor have to pay $$$).

> Meanwhile these competitors rush to copy everything else Apple does.

And Apple copies everything their competitors do also. Just look at iOS 8, that was just copying some of the best features from their competition (not that I blame them, they were right to do so).

The new keyboard (Android), third party keyboards (Android), "Handoff" (everyone else), Spotlight web-search (everyone else), etc.

Apple hasn't done anything original since Jobs died.

Re:Apple – Live – September 2014 Special Event by MCRed on Tuesday September 09, 2014 @12:56PM (#8291201)
Bonjour was released under an open source license, part of it the Apache license, and does not require a royalty to be paid to Apple.

I turned on HTML5 video for youtube and I still have this problem, because they don't encode all videos in MP4.

Re:Apple – Live – September 2014 Special Event by deelowe on Tuesday September 09, 2014 @01:11PM (#8291324)
You seem to have missed this bit

> Because people would have to pay licensing fees several times for the same stream

Many groups have spoken out about the licensing issues with pictures, video, and audio. That's what has created this mess.

Re:Apple – Live – September 2014 Special Event by jacquesm on Tuesday September 09, 2014 @12:51PM (#8291162)
> Ever since Apple originated consumer computer video with Quicktime back in the early 1990s

I think that honor befalls the ITU with their H.261. It's only a few years difference and it definitely was never as wide spread as Quicktime but that's the first format that I remember that actually worked. It never succeeded on the web though there were a couple of companies that tried to do this using so called browser plug-ins.

Live streaming is mostly the domain of RTMP these days, HTTP doesn't lend itself well to live (but works just fine for streaming stored content).

As for why browsers don't all do MP4, you could ask why browsers do not natively support RTMP, that would solve the whole problem in one go.

Re:Apple – Live – September 2014 Special Event by lostgame on Tuesday September 09, 2014 @12:34PM (#8291074)
What, what? YouTube has been doing an HTML5 based web player for quite some time now[1], and I believe it supports FLV video as well, though I can't find a reference for that.

[1] https://www.youtube.com/html5?gl=CA

Re:Apple – Live – September 2014 Special Event by MCRed on Tuesday September 09, 2014 @12:48PM (#8291147)
I have uninstalled Flash from my system. A great many videos on YouTube give me the "you need the latest flash player to watch this video" error.

Yes, several years ago, I was getting MP4 video, and today, a portion (say %30-%40) just launch with MP4. But most of the time I get the "you need flash".

Re:Apple – Live – September 2014 Special Event by archagon on Tuesday September 09, 2014 @04:47PM (#8292976)
It's really weird. Using the built-in HTML5 player, half the videos don't load. But those videos do exist — Google just doesn't want you to be able to access them easily. I can watch them on my iOS devices, I can download them using dirpy.com, and I can watch them in my browser using the YouTube5 plugin.
Re:Apple – Live – September 2014 Special Event by jjoonathan on Tuesday September 09, 2014 @01:01PM (#8291231)
I don't think you can use the HTML5 player for videos with ads. It's an elephant of a caveat.
Re:Apple – Live – September 2014 Special Event by aroman on Tuesday September 09, 2014 @04:10PM (#8292651)
This was true at one point, but no longer. The HTML5 video player displays ads just fine these days.
Re:Apple – Live – September 2014 Special Event by Kurtz79 on Tuesday September 09, 2014 @02:02PM (#8291627)
Serious question: what is the state of the art for in-browser live streaming to date ?

Twitch, Google Hangouts, any "live" sport event what protocol/technology do they use ?

A mix of HLS and flash ?

Re:Apple – Live – September 2014 Special Event by niutech on Tuesday September 09, 2014 @05:41PM (#8293384)
There are many protocols, including HTTP Live Streaming, RTSP, RTP, MMS, used by multiple browser plugins, such as QuickTime, Flash, Windows Media Player. A comprehensive list of such systems is on Wikipedia: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Comparison_of_streaming_media_s...
Re:Apple – Live – September 2014 Special Event by duskwuff on Tuesday September 09, 2014 @02:22PM (#8291740)
Twitch uses HLS with a Flash front end. No idea about the others.

HLS is nice because it doesn't require any new servers or protocols -- it uses vanilla HTTP, and can be served up by basically any web server. As a result, it's much easier to make it work with a CDN.

Re:Apple – Live – September 2014 Special Event by Kurtz79 on Tuesday September 09, 2014 @04:24PM (#8292784)
Thanks.

I guess the reason of having such poor support outside Apple browsers, despite the benefits, has to do with licensing issues and the complications of embedding ads, as someone pointed out.

Re:Apple – Live – September 2014 Special Event by jgh on Tuesday September 09, 2014 @02:28PM (#8291781)
Yes.
Re:Apple – Live – September 2014 Special Event by cheald on Tuesday September 09, 2014 @12:27PM (#8291023)
You can watch in non-Safari browsers if you change the user agent.
Re:Apple – Live – September 2014 Special Event by efa on Tuesday September 09, 2014 @01:07PM (#8291283)
Yep, I noticed that the other day on their developers site. Couldn't watch a video on Swift because I'm not on OSX Safari! Something Microsoft would do 15 years ago.
Re:Apple – Live – September 2014 Special Event by AlexeyBrin on Tuesday September 09, 2014 @12:08PM (#8290876)
Check the comments, someone already solved this:

https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=8290769

Re:Apple – Live – September 2014 Special Event by Aardwolf on Tuesday September 09, 2014 @12:10PM (#8290890)
Well, still, for a company that tries to make everything "simple and beautiful", why don't their video streams just work everywhere out of the box? That is the question.
Re:Apple – Live – September 2014 Special Event by MCRed on Tuesday September 09, 2014 @12:23PM (#8290996)
What Apple's live streaming does, is in a CDN friendly way dynamically adjust the bandwidth going to a stream consumer. It's a great invention and there's no reason other people haven't adopted it. It's not being proprietary, it's simply being smart, because it's not trivial to do this kind of broadcast on the internet.

Here's the reality of video, and this goes for a lot of things that Apple makes "simple and beautiful". They fundamentally aren't. Video is a fundamentally difficult mess, a PITA, and the only way to have it work really smoothly is to have enough control over the entire stack to ensure that things work they way they are supposed to... and even then it doesn't always work. People adopting MP4 as a standard has gone a long way towards making things "just work" generally, but it's not sufficient by itself for a quality live stream.

I remember trying to watch a previous live stream from south america and the difficulties I had, even though I was using Apple devices and software the whole way.

Simple and Beautiful is a contradiction from "everywhere out of the box".

Those are two opposite goals.

This is an important thing to understand about software broadly, but with video it borders on impossible.

Re:Apple – Live – September 2014 Special Event by simonbh on Tuesday September 09, 2014 @12:47PM (#8291141)
The thing is that any cable company in the US and Canada that streams content to their customers via the Internet is using adaptive bitrate streaming either using HTTP Live Streaming, MPEG DASH, HTTP Dynamic Streaming, or Microsoft Smooth Streaming. It is far from impossible.
Re:Apple – Live – September 2014 Special Event by seren on Tuesday September 09, 2014 @12:16PM (#8290925)
Everything is simple and beautiful if you are already embedded in the ecosystem/walled garden. If you are an outsider, it is another matter... Isn't it more or less the goal of every tech giant ?
Re:Apple – Live – September 2014 Special Event by nyrulez on Tuesday September 09, 2014 @12:36PM (#8291086)
Apple fans can justify anything - so don't expect anyone to say, yeah they are behind the curve on this.

The better answer is probably: "They simply don't care". No ifs and buts. Probably making it a bit exclusive and hard to get to only adheres to their marketing philosophy.

Re:Apple – Live – September 2014 Special Event by efa on Tuesday September 09, 2014 @01:09PM (#8291312)
The community has closed this channel due to terms of service violations
Re:Apple – Live – September 2014 Special Event by jonursenbach on Tuesday September 09, 2014 @12:08PM (#8290874)
This is nothing new. Their streamed events have always been locked down to Safari on OS X and iOS.