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Re:Fired? Speak No Evil by logfromblammo on Friday January 03, 2014 @12:39PM (#7006747)
While working in at-will states, the severance agreement may in fact be the first document you sign that is actually legally binding upon the company in any way.

Most offers I see are clear that the letter is not a contract, and no contract can even exist without direct and explicit intervention by the CEO. And that seems to be a left-handed way of saying that if you do try to get an actual contract, you will not be successful, and the offer of employment will be withdrawn. I would very much like to see more at-will workers do same-day resignations when they change jobs, possibly even writing their own severance agreements.

It isn't unprofessional to abruptly walk out on the job if giving notice was never in the requirements. And most of the time, all that you get for the courtesy of making it easier for the employer to replace you is a payout for your accumulated vacation time, if anything.

Re:Fired? Speak No Evil by cbr on Friday January 03, 2014 @12:48PM (#7006797)

    It isn't unprofessional to abruptly walk out on the job
    if giving notice was never in the requirements.
While you would be fully within your legal rights to quit without notice, and they would be fully within theirs to fire you effective immediately with no severance, both would be rude, contrary to custom, and unprofessional. It's reasonable and healthy to have customs that are not fully backed by the law, and trying to set up the law to fully match our senses of justice would be massive overengineering.
Re:Fired? Speak No Evil by logfromblammo on Friday January 03, 2014 @01:45PM (#7007197)
Having recently experienced such rudeness from an employer, I feel fully justified in recommending tit-for-tat retaliation from employees. Holding to human standards of decency is no longer warranted when your employer no longer views you as a human being.

Given the behavior of my current company towards all of its employees, I am looking to go elsewhere, and when I do, I won't worry overly much about burning those bridges behind me. The at-will sword is two-edged, so let the other guy feel the backswing occasionally.

Re:Fired? Speak No Evil by bradleyjg on Friday January 03, 2014 @01:24PM (#7007074)
That's true in general, but conditional severance isn't the same thing as unconditional severance. Conditional severance, depending on the conditions, may well be a quid pro quo. If the money is compensation for e.g. a non-disparagement clause than it isn't also customary two weeks severance.

If such practices are widespread in a particular industry than that industry in practice doesn't provide severance. In those circumstances, it makes sense to withdraw the corresponding practice of giving notice. Or perhaps instead substituting a practice of conditional notice.

Re:Fired? Speak No Evil by wpietri on Friday January 03, 2014 @01:50PM (#7007238)
> It isn't unprofessional to abruptly walk out on the job if giving notice was never in the requirements.

I disagree. One of the things that distinguishes professional behavior for me is having professional standards. That is, no matter what your clients or employers do, there are certain ways you plan to behave. For me that would definitely include a good handover.

Of course, my professional standards also include refusing to build things that are obviously dumb, dangerous, or destructive. But a disturbing number of developers feel that they should just do whatever their bosses tell them, no matter the disaster that they set in motion. So one could argue that a lot of IT-related jobs are more trades than professions, in which case a "take this job and shove it" exit could be more acceptable. Not because it isn't unprofessional behavior, but because professional behavior isn't expected.

Re:Fired? Speak No Evil by logfromblammo on Friday January 03, 2014 @02:29PM (#7007515)
When an employer treats the employee unprofessionally, is that not an indication that professional behavior is not expected? If you have an expectation that your employer will provide notice and severance before termination, as might be specified in an employee handbook and verified by departing colleages, then giving notice before resignation would be appropriate. If, on the other hand, your company has in the past terminated people without cause, notice, or severance, and the handbook states in no uncertain terms, "You LOSE. Good DAY, sir," then I think any gestures for your personal honor will be lost.

We have no union or professional association to protect our interests in my labor category. We have only the willingness to be faithful and courteous to those who treat us well, and to be stubborn and vindictive to those who would abuse our good faith. Bite the hand that beats you.

Re:Fired? Speak No Evil by wpietri on Friday January 03, 2014 @06:04PM (#7008886)
No. If ethics are purely determined by how other people act, they aren't ethics.

I think that professionals have to be careful in who they choose to work for, but once they start, they should act professionally. That includes leaving professionally.

Re:Fired? Speak No Evil by logfromblammo on Sunday January 05, 2014 @02:15AM (#7014943)
If you don't make some allowance for other people's behavior in your ethical system, your ethical strategy can easily be subverted by someone else that does.

In game theory simulations, strategies that respond to counterparty behaviors, such as tit-for-tat, always outperform those that do not, such as always-cooperate, always-reneg, and random-choice strategies.

Your strategy is apparently always-cooperate. It's a loser. If you do not penalize bad behavior or unbalanced deals, they will become more prevalent in the environment.

Re:Fired? Speak No Evil by wpietri on Sunday January 12, 2014 @12:33AM (#7045269)
My strategy is not actually always-cooperate, and I don't fathom how you got that from my words.
Re:Fired? Speak No Evil by mcv on Friday January 03, 2014 @04:07PM (#7008147)
> t isn't unprofessional to abruptly walk out on the job if giving notice was never in the requirements.

Depends on circumstances and the details of your profession. If you're just a badly-treated wage slave, then definitely: walk out as soon as you find something better.

But I'm an independent contractor/freelancer, and I'm currently working on a project that would probably take about a year. But my contract is always to the end of the quarter and gets extended by a quarter. I could probably refuse such a contract extension, and I considered it, because a previous client where I really, really enjoyed working, asked me if I was available. But I didn't because I felt it would be unprofessional to leave at this stage.

Re:Fired? Speak No Evil by logfromblammo on Sunday January 05, 2014 @02:25AM (#7014970)
It seems to me that a project that should take a year should have contracts that last for the entire duration.

If we're talking about professionalism, at what point did you bring up to the client that their quarterly contracting strategy leaves them extremely vulnerable to losing critical personnel before the work gets finished? I think what happened there is that they leveraged their project management flexibility against your sense of integrity, and you lost.

Re:Fired? Speak No Evil by mcv on Tuesday January 07, 2014 @03:32AM (#7016280)
They're big. The people I talk to don't control the policies regarding contracts.

In any case, I didn't lose anything. As long as I get paid for the hours I work, I'm happy. I'd be totally fine with the contract getting terminated tomorrow. I'm also fine with working here for another half year. But at more than a year, I think I'd get itchy.

Re:Fired? Speak No Evil by auctiontheory on Friday January 03, 2014 @02:24PM (#7007477)
It isn't unprofessional to abruptly walk out on the job if giving notice was never in the requirements.

I don't think "unprofessional" means what you think it means. It is not, for instance, a synonym for "illegal."