News for hackers. Stuff that matters.
Re:Denial-of-service tool targeting Healthcare.gov site disc... by ctdonath on Thursday November 07, 2013 @12:24PM (#6690718)
I can't refer to the legislation by its name because I consider its name disingenuous. A rose by any other name may smell as sweet, but calling dung a rose doesn't make it smell any better. Words mean things; "affordable" the act isn't. The legislation itself raises all sorts of issues that have nothing to do with health care.

ETA: "Obamacare" is used because it's a catchy name which is both quite descriptive (Obama pushed this healthcare law thru, so he owns it) and is not inherently insulting (like "Bushoppression" or "Obamasux" mentioned elsewhere in this thread). Use of this popular nickname causes a frenzy because of its subject, not its inherent phrasing - it is not an ad-hominem attack.

Re:Denial-of-service tool targeting Healthcare.gov site disc... by mkramlich on Thursday November 07, 2013 @01:01PM (#6691044)
> (Obama pushed this healthcare law thru, so he owns it)

Facts:

Congressional majority voted in favor of it, then Obama signed it, turning it into the law of the land. All those individuals were voted into their jobs by the American people, by a majority of voters.

The Supreme Court then upheld it.

The same President who, as you said, pushed for it, and signed it into law, and who was the candidate of the very party which also comprised the overwhelming majority of the Congressional votes which turned it into law, was then chosen by a majority of voters to be re-elected as President for a second term.

Now, that law is starting to finally go fully into effect.

This is how government works. All the key players above were either elected directly (or put into place indirectly by the former) by a majority of American voters. Your side (I assume), lost. It happens. This is a democracy.

Re:Denial-of-service tool targeting Healthcare.gov site disc... by kapitalx on Thursday November 07, 2013 @12:46PM (#6690907)
As an anecdote, we signed up my inlaws for $2/month after subsidies. Until now they couldn't afford the $900/month so they didn't have insurance. I'd say that's pretty affordable, almost free.
Re:Denial-of-service tool targeting Healthcare.gov site disc... by trebor on Thursday November 07, 2013 @01:14PM (#6691160)
It isn't free. Someone else is paying your parent's bill, either through their own premiums (which some say have tripled, though they have no prior conditions) or through taxes. Don't judge the price till the bill takes full effect; you may not be smiling.
Re:Denial-of-service tool targeting Healthcare.gov site disc... by gte910h on Thursday November 07, 2013 @04:20PM (#6692479)
And people were paying for their medical care gotten in emergency rooms too
Re:Denial-of-service tool targeting Healthcare.gov site disc... by kapitalx on Saturday November 16, 2013 @01:22PM (#6745814)
Free from their point of view, not yours or mine! We're talking about affordability not where the money is coming from.
Re:Denial-of-service tool targeting Healthcare.gov site disc... by mkramlich on Thursday November 07, 2013 @12:57PM (#6691005)
Think of it this way. Let's say the two of us were talking. And your real name was John Smith (making this up, I have no idea and not relevant). I had a choice between referring to you as "idiot" or "John." The latter is factually correct, neutral and lacks emotional triggers.

Using your logic, you shouldn't call Social Security Social Security you should call it FDR Forced Set Asides. Because you know, nobody likes being forced by the government to set aside their hard earned cash by some politician, and one who's personally and solely responsible for that happening. And which has absolutely no upside to it at all, of course. But wait, that wouldn't be true. So people don't do that. They call it Social Security. Because that is it's name, and is less loaded, and more politically neutral.

Re:Denial-of-service tool targeting Healthcare.gov site disc... by aestra on Thursday November 07, 2013 @01:15PM (#6691168)
Um, I don't consider "Obamacare" emotional, I consider it neutral. I just think it's a catchy nickname for legislation. It is neither negative or positive.
Re:Denial-of-service tool targeting Healthcare.gov site disc... by gnaritas on Thursday November 07, 2013 @01:52PM (#6691510)
It doesn't matter what you consider it, it matters what others consider it and it most certainly is emotional to most. That the affordable care act polls higher than Obamacare should make that clear to you.
Re:Denial-of-service tool targeting Healthcare.gov site disc... by jack-r-abbit on Thursday November 07, 2013 @02:39PM (#6691882)
The real name isn't really neutral either. You have to consider at least a little bit that having the word "affordable" in the name is naturally going to bias people toward it. I doubt the Subsidized Care Act would poll very favorably.
Re:Denial-of-service tool targeting Healthcare.gov site disc... by gnaritas on Thursday November 07, 2013 @03:31PM (#6692182)
The real name doesn't have to be neutral, it has the benefit of being the actual name and thus is correct to use when you are being neutral.
Re:Denial-of-service tool targeting Healthcare.gov site disc... by jack-r-abbit on Thursday November 07, 2013 @03:52PM (#6692294)
You said: That the affordable care act polls higher than Obamacare should make that clear to you.

So I meant during the polling... one name already had bias baked into it by using the word affordable rather than the word subsidized. Not many people are keen on subsidies when you call them subsidies. But if you just say something is now more affordable and don't tell people it is more affordable because it is subsidized, you have baked in a bias from the start. So naturally that bias is going to be reflected in more favorable polling results.

Re:Denial-of-service tool targeting Healthcare.gov site disc... by aestra on Thursday November 07, 2013 @02:29PM (#6691813)
Ok, is it supposed to be negative or positive?
Re:Denial-of-service tool targeting Healthcare.gov site disc... by gnaritas on Thursday November 07, 2013 @03:32PM (#6692186)
Not relevant.
Re:Denial-of-service tool targeting Healthcare.gov site disc... by aestra on Thursday November 07, 2013 @03:58PM (#6692341)
Of course it's relevant. I (and every other person I know personally) have been calling it by it's shorthand Obamacare when discussing it and I would like to know if we have been using this "emotional" word to portray the bill positively or negatively.
Re:Denial-of-service tool targeting Healthcare.gov site disc... by awj on Thursday November 07, 2013 @01:42PM (#6691405)
> Um, I don't consider "Obamacare" emotional, I consider it neutral.

Read some of the opposition to it. For many people it is not a neutral name.

Re:Denial-of-service tool targeting Healthcare.gov site disc... by Permit on Thursday November 07, 2013 @12:30PM (#6690771)
Please. We call the "Patriot Act" the "Patriot Act". We called SOPA by its name despite disagreeing that it would "Stop Online Piracy".
Re:Denial-of-service tool targeting Healthcare.gov site disc... by dragonwriter on Thursday November 07, 2013 @01:08PM (#6691103)
Its not "the Patriot Act". Its "the USA PATRIOT Act". And USA PATRIOT is not just a ridiculous emotional appeal embedded into a name, its also an acronym for "Uniting and Strengthening America by Providing Appropriate Tools Required to Intercept and Obstruct Terrorism".
Re:Denial-of-service tool targeting Healthcare.gov site disc... by jack-r-abbit on Thursday November 07, 2013 @01:21PM (#6691220)
I find it hard to believe the long title came first and just happened to condense to USA PATRIOT. That had to be at least partially a backronym[1].

[1] http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Backronym

Re:Denial-of-service tool targeting Healthcare.gov site disc... by timdiggerm on Thursday November 07, 2013 @12:56PM (#6690999)
This is as ridiculous as Stallman's insisting on calling things by the wrong name all the time.
Re:Denial-of-service tool targeting Healthcare.gov site disc... by skwirl on Thursday November 07, 2013 @12:28PM (#6690749)
What do you call the PATRIOT act?
Re:Denial-of-service tool targeting Healthcare.gov site disc... by ctdonath on Thursday November 07, 2013 @12:34PM (#6690804)
Treason.
Re:Denial-of-service tool targeting Healthcare.gov site disc... by skwirl on Thursday November 07, 2013 @12:44PM (#6690880)
So when it comes up for renewal, you go around saying "I hope they don't renew treason this year." That use of language must make communication somewhat difficult.