> I'm not arguing that excercise is unhealthy, it's just that its contribution to eventual longevity, is currently unknown

I see numerous studies indicating that exercise contributes directly to eventual longevity, e.g.:

https://www.ama-assn.org/public-health/prevention-wellness/m...

https://www.acc.org/latest-in-cardiology/articles/2025/07/02...

https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC3395188/

Thank you for the resources.

I do wonder what the correlation is: is it only because of excercise, or at least partially also due to the fact those who can set aside time and effort (and often, money) to exercise, have a "better" life than those who don't?

For example, high life expectancy in Madrid, and Switzerland are often attributed to having broad access to great healthcare and stress-free lifestyle(both), despite living a relatively "unhealthy" lifestyle, at least in Madrid. Eating fried food everyday, little exercize among elderly (at least if you don't count walking to the bar). Those 85 year+ Madrileños probably had their last formal exercise when they had to do their military service back in the day.

As in the case of top athletes, in your second article, is their longevity due to heavy exercise, or kind of, "despite it", and at least partially due to their accumulated wealth, health-conscious mindset plus the ability to afford a stress-free life?

The equation is not simply "exercise" -> "live longer" via some unknown correlation.

Exercise increases cardiovascular health, mental well-being, etc. It should be pretty obvious that someone with less risk of heart failure will live longer on average (considering the #1 cause of death in the US...) I don't think you need to factor for every possible life circumstance to deduce that known-healthy activities improve longevity

For all we know, there is a link between cardiac/circulatory problems and arteriosclerosis (that is, loss of elasticity of the vessels).

So it could be that exercise helps keep this elasticity, the same way maybe sauna does? Also antioxidants from vegetables etc.

So it could be that it is a _factor_, but definitely needs way more study.

I am also not in the medical field, but I think arteriosclerosis is a well known link for cardiovascular disease.

There is some evidence suggesting that "blue zones" are largely about pension fraud. https://fortune.com/europe/2024/12/14/are-blue-zones-myth-ex...

You're saying that crime leads to longevity? Big if true.

I think the claim is more that if you provide financial support for X without solid record keeping to verify X, expect that you will get more self reported people in that description.

Put differently, relying on self reporting for any sort of status from people is just not a reliable methodology.

Fraud leads to people officially living beyond their natural death, yes.

No, he is saying bad record keeping means misreporting identity has a bigger chance of happening.

> People living in areas with longevity (blue zones), didn't really excercise (as in sports)

Not exercising as in sports and not exercising, period, are very different. If you look at the American blue zone, those people are certainly exercising; daily nature walks are baked into their theology.

Problem is sauna use and genetic factors corrolate too strongly to make any conclusion to the broader population. If you live in/near Finland you likely sauna often, as have all your ancestors for thousands of years. If you don't live there both are false. Thus we can't know if Sauna is helpful for the general population who isn't of a Finish background.

Japan has a +4 years lead of life expectancy over Finland; Norway almost +3 years on Finland. I am not saying this is conclusive per se, but to me the sauna-people-live-forever is not backed up by the data. I would instead reason that, e. g. weight correlates a lot more here.

Nobody is claiming they live forever. The claim is sauna use increases lifespan. There are other factors than just sauna use in lifespan though. The question is would the Japanese live even longer if they were using a sauna?

A lot of Mediterranean countries also have high life expectancy and are the opposite of a sauna culture.

Cyprus summers are like 45C and its almost like a sauna :)

Maybe eating a lot of fish, rather than meat, has an impact too.

Your comparison reads to suggest that Japan doesn't have Onsen culture or that sauna does not exist in Norway.

That's to say, many cultures from around the globe have developed similar activities that heat the body.

Saunas are common in Norway, even if not to the same degree as in Finland. The reason Finland has had a lower life expectancy than Norway is believed to be due to the difference in diet (cardivascular issues). Note that the diet in Finland has changed quite a lot over the last decades and these differences will presumably level out, statistically.

The "blue-zone" studies are flawed, so we shouldn't infer too much from lifestyle generalizations about people in them.

https://www.science.org/content/article/do-blue-zones-suppos...

Saunas have not been around longer than exercise.