News for hackers. Stuff that matters.
Re:How Long Will Programmers Be So Well-Paid? by HeyLaughingBoy on Saturday October 27, 2012 @11:55AM (#4706386)
Are you in the Minneapolis, MN area? Do you have a technical degree (CS, CE, or other science or engineering degree?) Are you a skilled developer? Not just a coder who can patch together bits of code and read an API, but someone who can take a requirement and talk to the users and understand what it is they really want, then architect, design, code and test a subsystem that is not allowed to fail in its operating environment. I don't much care what languages you know, although knowledge of C++ would be nice. Can you demonstrate to me in a 1 hour interview that you are good at what you do? I'm not going to read your github code, but if you can demo a working application you wrote on your own I will look at it and ask design & implementation questions.

That's basically what we look for, and trust me, it's very difficult to find someone who comes close. Code monkeys, OTOH, are easy to find.

Re:How Long Will Programmers Be So Well-Paid? by TheEzEzz on Saturday October 27, 2012 @12:15PM (#4706447)
> someone who can take a requirement and talk to the users and understand what it is they really want, then architect, design, code and test a subsystem that is not allowed to fail in its operating environment

You are asking for someone that can complete an entire product cycle by themselves. The power of a company is in bringing together complementary people that complete a whole, not in finding a single person that does everything you need. Why would a person with the skill set of an entire team want to work for a company, rather than starting their own?

Re:How Long Will Programmers Be So Well-Paid? by jtheory on Saturday October 27, 2012 @03:12PM (#4706928)
I suspect you're thinking of a product that would support a business -- the post you're responding to mentions a "subsystem".

This is only a few steps beyond what anyone who completes a CS degree does at least two or three times during their coursework. If you take one of your end-of-year projects, do the work to make it actually robust enough for other people to use, and share it with the world (then do a few iterations of "wow, people aren't using this how I thought" and "wow, apparently that wasn't robust at all" and "damn I need real revision control", or even "huh; no one seems to want this at all") -- and fix the things that were wrong with your first attempts -- you're now far more valuable working any part of the process in large project dev than any of your classmates.

Your project doesn't need to be big -- it probably shouldn't be, or you'll never get it out the door -- but scoping it is a lesson in itself that's really valuable to future employers.

This is how I got my first software engineer job, fresh out of undergrad with a major in music; I had developed a set of music theory training drills, put them online (for free) and had already fought my way through a lot of lessons about browser incompatibilities, usability for non-technical users, how to support non-technical users effectively, etc. etc..

There was no way in hell I was ready to start a business of my own, at that point, and I was eager to work with more experienced developers -- I wanted to learn better ways to solve the problems I was struggling with -- so in seeking a job I wasn't just someone saying "I learned some stuff in school; can you pay me money for it?". I was saying "I already know somewhat what you do here; I want to learn how to do it really well, with you -- will you pay me to do that?"

Re:How Long Will Programmers Be So Well-Paid? by HeyLaughingBoy on Saturday October 27, 2012 @04:10PM (#4707103)
Exactly. I really don't think that what we ask for should be hard to find, but experience proves otherwise.
Re:How Long Will Programmers Be So Well-Paid? by mooreds on Saturday October 27, 2012 @01:51PM (#4706716)
It is interesting that they are looking for someone who can complete an entire product cycle. Maybe looking for flexibility, if they are a consulting shop? Or seniority--someone who can do all that has been around the block? Or maybe they are such a small shop they can't afford specialists?

I have been in this full lifecycle role almost my entire career, often as a consultant, and it has benefits and downsides. You are always learning something new and have a wide view of the software world, as well as the ability to really dig into new toes of problems. But sometimes you feel a mile wide and an inch deep.

Re:How Long Will Programmers Be So Well-Paid? by HeyLaughingBoy on Saturday October 27, 2012 @04:07PM (#4707093)
Nope, I work for a multibillion dollar company. We don't have separate roles like "architect," "business analyst"," "programmer," etc. We hire people who can be given a requirement, and then trusted to get it fully implemented. In the beginning, especially if you're fresh out of school, you may be given a simple design and told "code this," but that phase doesn't last very long.
Re:How Long Will Programmers Be So Well-Paid? by kkreamer on Saturday October 27, 2012 @08:40PM (#4707735)
> Why would a person with the skill set of an entire team want to work for a company, rather than starting their own?

I've completed an entire product cycle by myself, more than once, but still work for a company.

Working for a company means I don't have to go out and find the customers, I don't have to do sales and marketing, and I don't have to do the hiring, firing, and day-to-day management of employees. Basically, there's more to running a company than the parts of a product cycle, and insofar as I might be capable of doing all of those other things, I don't enjoy it as much as focusing on solving problems.

Re:How Long Will Programmers Be So Well-Paid? by rrouse on Saturday October 27, 2012 @12:14PM (#4706444)
Is physical presence a requirement? You could try looking outside the area.

My current job is with a distributed team. I'm in St. Louis. Others are in Toronto, New Jersey (previously was in Spain), and South Carolina. It works well for us since we don't have "must-be-locked-down-on-site" sorts of projects (e.g. government contracts)

Re:How Long Will Programmers Be So Well-Paid? by dschiptsov on Saturday October 27, 2012 @02:42PM (#4706849)
someone who can take a requirement and talk to the users and understand what it is they really want, then architect, design, code and test a subsystem that is not allowed to fail in its operating environment - that someone need no other guys standing between him and money.
[deleted]
Re:How Long Will Programmers Be So Well-Paid? by HeyLaughingBoy on Saturday October 27, 2012 @04:11PM (#4707107)
What do you mean by that?