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Re:A Brief Look at FreeBSD by clan on Wednesday November 12, 2025 @02:45PM (#45905323)
I daily drive FreeBSD on my desktop with KDE. It is not as smooth as Linux and requires a little more tinkering compared to Linux. But I love it!

The killer features for me:

- The pf firewall. Rules you actually understand!

- Jails! When you cannot have Zones this will do.

- Native ZFS. Stable, mature, safe and with all the features you can dream of.

- Linuxulator. Binary compatibility with Linux if need be. Can be put in jail as well.

- pkg/ports. I really like it but I might have been indoctrinated.

- Networking stack. Good. Stable. Makes sense to me.

For a nice graphical UI Linux is more smooth but if you are willing to tinker it can work. As Linux gets all the attention you will see stuff such as Chromium lag behind.

I can understand that can scare people off. But FreeBSD feels like a comfortable old glove for me. I will suffer the minor holes. My beard has grayed and my hair line is non-existant.

If waiting for a laptop I would perhaps wait for FreeBSD 15 for much needed improvements in WIFI. If you want fast WIFI today you need weird hacks routing through a Linux VM[1]. It works rather well but it is honestly a bit clunky.

[1] https://github.com/pgj/freebsd-wifibox

Re:A Brief Look at FreeBSD by doublerabbit on Wednesday November 12, 2025 @04:16PM (#45906829)
I daily drive FreeBSD with IceWM, four screens 2@4k, 2@1080p running with Xorg on a Sapphire 5600XT, I can't fault any issues.
Re:A Brief Look at FreeBSD by clan on Wednesday November 12, 2025 @04:49PM (#45907246)
Exactly. When it works it is great.

I stick with a single 43" 4K@60 but it was a bit of a challenge to get on the happy path:

https://forums.freebsd.org/threads/intermittent-scanline-fli...

All systems can have issues. But the more widely used systems are at an advantage.

Re:A Brief Look at FreeBSD by BLKNSLVR on Wednesday November 12, 2025 @08:39PM (#45909400)
Are the screens directly connected or do you use a docking station? If docking station, does it require DisplayLink drivers to drive the monitors?
Re:A Brief Look at FreeBSD by doublerabbit on Thursday November 13, 2025 @07:53AM (#45914321)
No docking station.

Although the 2x4k monitors are daisy chained. I was surprised when it worked first time.

Re:A Brief Look at FreeBSD by gerdesj on Wednesday November 12, 2025 @04:40PM (#45907143)
I remember a hack, back in the day, on Linux where a Windows wifi driver was used via a thing called NDISwrapper. Be patient and hopefully you'll soon be looking back on your Linux VM bodge in the rear view mirror.
Re:A Brief Look at FreeBSD by riedel on Wednesday November 12, 2025 @06:47PM (#45908554)
Re:A Brief Look at FreeBSD by tsoukase on Wednesday November 12, 2025 @06:14PM (#45908252)
I haven't realised Ndiswrapper was deprecated in Linux. I thought I was too lucky with my WiFi cards in the last 10-15 years!
Re:A Brief Look at FreeBSD by gerdesj on Wednesday November 12, 2025 @06:49PM (#45908572)
Wifi isn't quite solved on any platform. It is also quite hard to decide what solved really looks like!

My wife and I have identical HP laptops. Her's runs Arch (as you do), with KDE and mine runs Kubuntu 25.10 at the mo. Both use NetworkManager.

I look after both.

Randomly after wake up from suspend, wifi may or may not still be working. When I say random, I mean after a kernel update or the wind changes direction. I think wifies lappy is OK now because I seem to get a lot less "support" calls for the last few weeks.

To be fair, there are a lot of moving parts from a lot of bits of Linux involved in a modern distro these days.

When I say hard to decide what solved looks like: if Samba or SSSD crap out, is that wifi's fault or the kernel/driver? This is exactly what Windows has had to solve over the years and I do note things like credential managers and mounts that manage to survive disconnects being bolted on to Linux.

All that scrappy stuff needs to be passed on to the BSDs too. Getting a laptop with file systems that come and go, with a dickey clock tick and networking that comes and goes and VPNs and all the rest.

Getting all of that to work is quite a job.

Re:A Brief Look at FreeBSD by o11c on Wednesday November 12, 2025 @08:18PM (#45909245)
Sounds exactly like my mom's Windows computer. Flaky wifi/power issues are not a Linux problem.
Re:A Brief Look at FreeBSD by tsoukase on Thursday November 13, 2025 @07:19AM (#45914028)
So I suppose: NEVER use WiFi for anything critical (server, security, high avail, medical etc). I don't know if WiFi cards of later devices are of subpar quality to reduce costs. The WiFi debugging is insane.
Re:A Brief Look at FreeBSD by alex1138 on Wednesday November 12, 2025 @05:10PM (#45907529)
Honestly, the problem is always the f!@#ing hardware, isn't it

The reason all this is hard is likely a remnant of what Microsoft did in the 1990s to the point where Non Windows OSes are given the shaft

Nvidia, Broadcom, Wifi generally, whatever

Re:A Brief Look at FreeBSD by winlundn on Wednesday November 12, 2025 @06:47PM (#45908557)
Oh yes, it /is/ the f!@#ing hardware. The core FreeBSD developers have taken their sweet time to add support for WiFi on anything IoT running FreeBSD. In other words — FreeBSD's core developers usually will not listen to users asking for such things unless maximum pressure gets applied in every separate instance. Disclaimer: I'm not a FreeBSD user. Apart from the halfway decent distros which use FreeBSD as their core OS, the FreeBSD developers in charge of FreeBSD itself will not add a GUI installer for some old school reason that really, only they would know of. One issue coming directly from this constraint is that if you run BSD through a VM — either on Linux or Windows it is rather difficult if not impossible to get past 1024 x 768 resolution without going through some major hoops. FreeBSD does not do a thorough job supporting VirtualBox instances, generally speaking. BSD is meant more for the back-end "bare metal" servers.
Re:A Brief Look at FreeBSD by alex1138 on Wednesday November 12, 2025 @06:54PM (#45908625)
I'm glad this fits with my intuition

I think they assume people know what they're doing but a little x session never hurt anyone?

Re:A Brief Look at FreeBSD by sharts on Wednesday November 12, 2025 @06:31PM (#45908422)
If only there would be a resurgence of BSD. linux always feels like the javascript of OS world.
Re:A Brief Look at FreeBSD by feelamee on Wednesday November 12, 2025 @07:35PM (#45908963)
if Linux is a JavaScript, then what is Windows? haha
Re:A Brief Look at FreeBSD by ux266478 on Wednesday November 12, 2025 @08:29PM (#45909316)
either bash, or one of those ridiculous mainframe languages from the 1960s with impossible-to-remember names
Re:A Brief Look at FreeBSD by IIsi50MHz on Sunday November 16, 2025 @09:27PM (#45950354)
I believe the Jargon File has a couple of lyrics about IBM and JCL, to the tune of the Mickey Mouse Club theme.
Re:A Brief Look at FreeBSD by antod on Thursday November 13, 2025 @05:24AM (#45913134)
IBM VisualAge Perl++
Re:A Brief Look at FreeBSD by tiltowait on Wednesday November 12, 2025 @09:23PM (#45909725)
I'm glad I'm not the only person with similar feelings. I'm perfectly comfortable in Linux, but there's a certain ... uncanniness to it that's hard to pin down. FreeBSD (and, I suspect, the other BSDs as well) just feels more coherent.
Re:A Brief Look at FreeBSD by skydhash on Wednesday November 12, 2025 @10:36PM (#45910279)
After daily driving OpenBSD and FreeBSD, i can point the finger at the kernel subsystems that tries to handle everything under the sun, but with no clear direction and competing projects with different designs. Everything is three or more layers, each governed by a different team and interacting in opaque ways.

Meanwhile in the *BSD, you have the devices or some other OS concepts/subsystems, then a control layer with the associated management tools. Any other tool is either an alternate version, or a UI paint job.

Re:A Brief Look at FreeBSD by tcmart14 on Thursday November 13, 2025 @12:55AM (#45911231)
Because it is. Linux doesn't really have a concrete idea of a "base system" like the BSDs do. Linux is more of a hodgepodge of components that are developed by different, and often a lot more isolated teams than we think, that all just gets integrated together. Which is truly an astonishing achievement of engineering, so I don't wanna seem like I am short selling it. Think of like the developer who work on gcc and the libc and the kernel, maybe some cross pollination, but not a lot. FreeBSD, the user land, kernel and even the libc team all happens under "1 roof."
Re:A Brief Look at FreeBSD by 0x457 on Wednesday November 12, 2025 @06:52PM (#45908594)
> If you want fast WIFI today

Fast still means beyond 802.11g? (11n support is incomplete, last time I checked)

Because there is no corporate sponsor that needs good Wi-Fi drivers on FreeBSD, I doubt it will ever be better. I guess Sony, but it's all custom for them. I doubt there is anything to contribute back, even if Sony was open to that idea.

Re:A Brief Look at FreeBSD by cperciva on Wednesday November 12, 2025 @08:02PM (#45909140)
FreeBSD has 802.11ac.
Re:A Brief Look at FreeBSD by tcmart14 on Thursday November 13, 2025 @12:51AM (#45911201)
But that is still for a limited number of chipsets though right? I would absolutely love to see way more support. I remember awhile back the FreeBSD Foundation putting some serious (on their scale of funds) funds to WiFi.
Re:A Brief Look at FreeBSD by cperciva on Thursday November 13, 2025 @01:25AM (#45911418)
I can't remember which chipsets support it. But yes, the FreeBSD Foundation has been putting a lot of money into laptop support, including wifi improvements.
Re:A Brief Look at FreeBSD by 0x457 on Thursday November 13, 2025 @02:14PM (#45919205)
Can it actually work at 802.11ac speeds? I recall it maxing out at 22mbps.
Re:A Brief Look at FreeBSD by cperciva on Thursday November 13, 2025 @04:33PM (#45920878)
I don't know exactly how fast it runs, and it will absolutely depend on your hardware and network, but I've definitely gotten more than that.
Re:A Brief Look at FreeBSD by 0x457 on Thursday November 13, 2025 @05:04PM (#45921238)
I guess it's better now then. To be clear, on linux the very same laptop in the very same location (dual boot) I got proper speed. The issue was entirely in FreeBSD drivers.
Re:A Brief Look at FreeBSD by cperciva on Thursday November 13, 2025 @06:39PM (#45922157)
Yes, we've definitely had improvements recently. 14.3 was much faster than 14.2 and 15.0 is even faster.
Re:A Brief Look at FreeBSD by theoldgreybeard on Wednesday November 12, 2025 @07:20PM (#45908825)
FreeBSD is worth using for native ZFS alone. BTRFS doesn't even come close.
Re:A Brief Look at FreeBSD by sbseitz on Wednesday November 12, 2025 @10:11PM (#45910077)
It’s all OpenZFS now, same as Linux lmao.
Re:A Brief Look at FreeBSD by theoldgreybeard on Wednesday November 12, 2025 @10:19PM (#45910147)
It's still out-of-tree though, isn't it?
Re:A Brief Look at FreeBSD by tcmart14 on Thursday November 13, 2025 @12:52AM (#45911213)
Yes and no. OpenZFS on Linux still isn't as seamless and most distros still don't make it easy to do ZFS on root. Its definitely gotten better though.
Re:A Brief Look at FreeBSD by akimbostrawman on Friday November 14, 2025 @04:30AM (#45925319)
I don't see any reason to use traditional ZFS on root when ZFSBootMenu is easier and better, also comparable to BSD's boot menus.
Re:A Brief Look at FreeBSD by myaccountonhn on Saturday November 15, 2025 @08:47AM (#45937440)
Is there a linux distro that makes the setup of zfsbootmenu easy? I found it to be quite a bit of work.
Re:A Brief Look at FreeBSD by jjav on Friday November 14, 2025 @04:13AM (#45925230)
What is the best (most reliable) way to run multiple Linux instances on a FreeBSD host?