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Re:O3 beats a master-level GeoGuessr player, even with fake ... by _heimdall on Tuesday April 29, 2025 @01:54PM (#43835868)
This seems like a great example of why some are so concerned with AI alignment.

The game rules were ambiguous and the LLM did what it needed to (and was allowed to) to win. It probably is against the spirit of the game to look things up online at all but no one thought to define that rule beforehand.

Re:O3 beats a master-level GeoGuessr player, even with fake ... by umanwizard on Tuesday April 29, 2025 @02:31PM (#43836310)
No, the game rules aren't ambiguous. This is 100% unambiguously cheating. From the list of things that are definitely considered cheating in the rules:

> using Google or other external sources of information as assistance during play.

The contents of URLs found during play is clearly an external source of information.

Re:O3 beats a master-level GeoGuessr player, even with fake ... by GaggiX on Tuesday April 29, 2025 @02:40PM (#43836420)
I believed the rules were not explained to the model so it does use what it can.
Re:O3 beats a master-level GeoGuessr player, even with fake ... by misnome on Tuesday April 29, 2025 @02:42PM (#43836445)
Then you can 100% not claim it is “Playing” the game
Re:O3 beats a master-level GeoGuessr player, even with fake ... by ben_w on Tuesday April 29, 2025 @03:52PM (#43837265)
That right there *is the alignment problem*.

If I task an AI with "peace on earth" and the solution the AI comes up with is ripped from The X-Files* and it kills everyone, it isn't good enough to say "that's cheating" or "that's not what I meant".

* https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Je_Souhaite

Re:O3 beats a master-level GeoGuessr player, even with fake ... by GaggiX on Tuesday April 29, 2025 @03:53PM (#43837271)
It's playing a game in which the rules are a bit ambiguous if not explained.
Re:O3 beats a master-level GeoGuessr player, even with fake ... by _heimdall on Tuesday April 29, 2025 @10:26PM (#43840569)
And in reality the set of rules we would need can never be fully explained.

Alignment is the goal of having an AI system understand what we would want it to do even when the rules weren't predefined. That's an impossible task, or rather its seemingly impossible and we don't yet know how to do it.

Re:O3 beats a master-level GeoGuessr player, even with fake ... by _heimdall on Tuesday April 29, 2025 @10:25PM (#43840555)
That's the alignment problem. We intended a certain set of rules but didn't define them completely, or there were conditions we didn't consider.

An AI wouldn't have to maliciously break a rule to go wrong. The point is that the system could so exactly what it was supposed to do, it plays within the given rules but the outcomes aren't what we wanted or intended.

Re:O3 beats a master-level GeoGuessr player, even with fake ... by tshaddox on Tuesday April 29, 2025 @05:07PM (#43838049)
o3 already is an external source of information. It's an online service backed by an enormous model generated from an even more enormous corpus of text via an enormous amount of computing power.
Re:O3 beats a master-level GeoGuessr player, even with fake ... by Filligree on Tuesday April 29, 2025 @07:40PM (#43839388)
o3 was the thing beating GeoGuessr. It isn't external to itself.
Re:O3 beats a master-level GeoGuessr player, even with fake ... by tshaddox on Wednesday April 30, 2025 @02:01AM (#43841717)
Sure, then o3 plus the World Wide Web was the thing playing the game, and also isn’t external to itself.
Re:O3 beats a master-level GeoGuessr player, even with fake ... by umanwizard on Wednesday April 30, 2025 @03:52AM (#43842349)
Right, and that’s indeed impressive! But still not what’s claimed in the headline.
Re:O3 beats a master-level GeoGuessr player, even with fake ... by tshaddox on Wednesday April 30, 2025 @01:44PM (#43848515)
That's debatable, given that searching the web is a standard feature of o3.
Re:O3 beats a master-level GeoGuessr player, even with fake ... by umanwizard on Wednesday April 30, 2025 @07:16PM (#43851781)
Fair enough, but searching the web is also a standard feature of humans, but explicitly prohibited when playing GG.
Re:O3 beats a master-level GeoGuessr player, even with fake ... by tshaddox on Thursday May 01, 2025 @02:10PM (#43861289)
The GeoGuessr Community Rules and Terms and Service strongly imply that users must be people, so we are already conceding that exception to the rules when we want computer systems to compete.
Re:O3 beats a master-level GeoGuessr player, even with fake ... by _heimdall on Tuesday April 29, 2025 @10:15PM (#43840493)
> > Using Google during rounds is technically cheating - I’m unsure about visiting domains you find during the rounds though. It certainly violates the spirit of the game, but it also shows the models are smart enough to use whatever information they can to win

Going off of the source article here, the author at least wasn't clear on whether the rules only prevent using google or if visiting any website is against the rules.

And either way, my point was that the person defining the rules to the LLM was ambiguous. The potential risk of misalignment isn't that a perfect set of rules can't be defined, its that the rules we do define will always be incomplete.