They didn’t leave as winners.

They did more so than they did as losers.

It spent $2.3 trillion, lost 2,324 U.S. military and 3,917 contractors. And then there’s the hundred thousand afghan deaths.

What did the US get?

https://www.usip.org/publications/2022/11/afghanistan-was-lo...

> What did the US get?

It improved the quality of life and security for the people their immeasurably positively. If the withdrawal had not happened, and better leadership was displayed, the would have been completely wiped out.

What they were trying to get, was another ally in the region. They could have to, if it weren't for poor leadership.

I know some of the things they were tying to get, and I’m also not convinced it was as altruistic as that. But I’m not talking about goals. What was achieved? It isn’t safer and the US hasn’t made an ally.

Those things have not been achieved. If those were the aims, the US lost and the Teliban won.

> Those things have not been achieved. If those were the aims, the US lost and the Teliban won.

That's one way to look at it sure. From a purely force against force perspective though, they didn't come anywhere close to losing.

> From a purely force against force perspective though, they didn't come anywhere close to losing

Yes, I agree. The US saw this as a military problem, but that was only part of it. Winning a particular ground battle, capturing a town etc was only part of what was needed.