I would rather not have to live through an emboldened and desperate autocracy rolling over Europe and opening up the very real possibility of a third world war.

and while we're here, since the US is ostensibly going isolationist, maybe they should stop telling the Ukrainians they need to submit to subjugation.

If Russia is powerful enough to take over Europe, how can Ukraine possibly win?

I think the story is Russia becomes powerful enough to threaten Europe, one state at a time.

Ukraine has an amazing job, but they wouldn't have been able to do even that without convincing others that it was in their best interest to fund the war. That's been clear from the beginning.

The war is the genocide. Putin’s invasion would have killed thousands, maybe tens of thousands and been over in a week. Western involvement changed that into the deaths of hundreds of thousands. What more effective means of self-genocide could Europe conceive? Germany cannot exactly round up a whole class of their own for slaughter again in their current political environment. The West (England, Germany, France, etc) caused WWI and WWII not Russia. Now we (America) should trust their vision to avoid WWIII? We should be clear who the problem is and stay out of it.

This is such incredibly twisted logic. I would have honestly been aghast to see this on HN a few years ago, but now the site seems nearly as infected as Facebook or X with this.

Ukraine remembers this: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Holodomor

For Ukraine to continue existing, the russians have to be driven out. Otherwise the genocide will continue. The genocide caused by russians, caused by russians invading Ukraine, caused by russians stealing Ukraine's children.

In america's right wing trump followers, there is utter, sociopathic, monstrous indifference to Ukraine's suffering.

So I'll ask you, personally: If the neighbouring state or country decided to invade and take over an area of your state, and you were told "you've been resisting too long, give in already and give up your fight", would you lay down and welcome the invaders you've been fighting? If you knew that the invaders were stealing children, and murdering whole towns?

You should not conflate Stalin with Russia. The socialists and communists were terrible for everyone everywhere they went…

I’m not blaming Ukrainians for fighting. I am saying it is evil to give Ukraine only enough to suffer. However Europe again has socialists in power and it again means death for Ukrainians.

As opposed to Russians in power which means death for Ukrainians?

If the West had just let Mr Hitler do what he wanted, so many deaths would have been avoided.

The US didn't get involved until Pearl Harbor.

FDR bending the Neutrality Act to support France and Britain is an important part of WW2 history - he was doing it before the invasion of Poland.

It's exactly what the Ukrainians are asking for - not troops, just weapons.

If Woodrow Wilson hadn't drawn Europe's borders to cause conflict many deaths could have been avoided.

You know buddy, I was there in Kyiv in that first week of invasion, and you know, the Western involvement was no where to be found, except for some infantry weapons (thanks for that). Again, hundreds of thousands of Ukrainians joined the military with full understanding that Russia has more of everything, that foreign support may not come and so on.

Yes, the primary effect of the war has been to kill young European men, and both Russia and Ukraine… and now perhaps England and others are all too eager to see it happen.

I don't think any of us do. And they'll take your donations either way, so I don't think that's in question.

What's your plan that results in Russia giving up the territory they've claimed and heading home?

What’s your plan to stop Russia to come back in 2 years after a “peace deal”?