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Re:TikTok is back in the App Store by boc on Thursday February 13, 2025 @11:05PM (#43044719)
I hope all the people working in tech today realize that once you let the executive ignore laws that you dislike, it's a very clear path to them ignoring laws that protect you and your companies. You WILL be a target eventually and nobody is going to protect you.

This is a slow-motion disaster but too many people are complacent because they think it's not going to affect them. No matter your political leanings we cannot allow a constitutional crisis to go unchecked. Things that we take for granted dissolve rapidly if institutions start grabbing power without consequences.

It's insane that Congress isn't stepping-up here.

Re:TikTok is back in the App Store by asveikau on Friday February 14, 2025 @12:15AM (#43045078)
This isn't a politics forum, but abolishing USAID without congress was also insane. I don't care if you dislike something USAID does or did, it would require congress to legally abolish it.

And a few other things, that's just a prominent example.

Congress is pretty much ignoring this. Both parties.

Re:TikTok is back in the App Store by throwing_away on Friday February 14, 2025 @01:57AM (#43045634)
We're in this position because Congress (very pragmatically) ceded their power to the executive.

I'm afraid everyone has lost the plot at this point though.

Re:TikTok is back in the App Store by ksynwa on Friday February 14, 2025 @02:10AM (#43045702)
How does Congress ceding power work? Is there a due process for this? Or do they just sit back and chill?
Re:TikTok is back in the App Store by netsharc on Friday February 14, 2025 @03:56AM (#43046334)
Probably like the apparatchik of the Soviet "parliament", that just rubber stamped everything, and can then enjoy the luxury of being the elite the rest of the day. Just needs more mistresses (corruption is already there), anyone got Matt Gaetz' number?

Alcoholic (speaking of Russian stereotypes!) wife-abuser as defense minister? Rubber-stamped! RFK as health minister? Rubber-stamped! Glory to the union!

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Supreme_Soviet_of_the_Soviet_U...

Re:TikTok is back in the App Store by throwing_away on Friday February 14, 2025 @02:36AM (#43045873)
I'm not sure if there's a definitive cause, I'm more describing the overall effect.

If you read the source: https://constitution.congress.gov/constitution/

On the "legislative" side:

> All legislative Powers herein granted shall be vested in a Congress of the United States, which shall consist of a Senate and House of Representatives.

> Congress shall have Power To ... declare War, grant Letters of Marque and Reprisal, and make Rules concerning Captures on Land and Water;

Meanwhile on the "executive" side:

> He shall have Power, by and with the Advice and Consent of the Senate, to make Treaties, provided two thirds of the Senators present concur;

To me, this is pretty clear, at least about things like war and treaties and land acquisition. But it's easy to come up with a ton of examples from all parties that seem to violate these very basic rules.

What I would read as very fundamental "violations" of the document are often upheld by courts as being in agreement with it.

So, to answer your question, yes, they just sit back and chill with a 76% disapproval rating, but it took 119 congresses to get there. https://news.gallup.com/poll/1600/congress-public.aspx

Re:TikTok is back in the App Store by mikehotel on Friday February 14, 2025 @02:31AM (#43045837)
By the majority in Congress voting to block any attempts to challenge the executive branch.

Judges are acting to stay executive orders, but judicial processes are deliberately slow and the current administration seated several current Supreme Court judges.

Civil disobedience and mass unrest seems inevitable when the rule of law and balance of powers is systemically undermined.

Re:TikTok is back in the App Store by jpster on Friday February 14, 2025 @09:27AM (#43048644)
Ceding power is certainly a choice. Long excerpt:

Yet initially the two current leaders of the Democratic Party seemed determined to broadcast their own weakness. Minority leader Hakeem Jeffries spent last week at a donor retreat with billionaire tech leaders, only to emerge whining, ‘What leverage do we have? They control the House, the Senate, and the presidency.’… Jeffries’s conflation of “leverage” with “holding a majority in a chamber” is jaw-dropping. Power—the ability to change the behavior of another—comes from information, charisma, law, attention, procedure, expertise, and the ability to convene and organize. … What could they have done? Here are four suggestions: First, vigorous procedural delay….. Second, convene and spotlight. They should not see their power just through the lens of how it has traditionally been used. Congressional Democratic leadership should also make full use of their own convening power, holding hearings taking testimony from fired and pressured employees…. Congressional Democrats can also do more on basic legal protection of the institution. The people’s house is under attack, and they should be wielding law like swords to defend it. While Democratic state attorneys general have been filing lawsuit after lawsuit, congressional leadership—whose own power as the lawmaking arm of the American public is being decimated—should understand they also need to play a key role in making sure lawsuits are brought to block the destruction. Whatever their legal abilities, they are all astute fundraisers, and can play matchmaker between constituents, possible plaintiffs, lawyers, and donors to make sure that effective and well-resourced lawsuits are brought to stop the illegal power plays….. Finally, they can go on offense, forcing Trump and Republicans to either help Americans, or clearly demonstrate that they don’t want to. That means being willing to work with Republicans—if they can get laws passed that make people’s lives better, and not focus on Democratic Party branding.”

https://www.thenation.com/article/politics/trump-musk-democr...

Re:TikTok is back in the App Store by wordofx on Friday February 14, 2025 @02:34AM (#43045855)
Good thing USAID wasn’t abolished.
Re:TikTok is back in the App Store by labster on Friday February 14, 2025 @02:46AM (#43045917)
Laws are just words on paper if no one decides to enforce them. What is Congress going to do to Trump, impeach him? lol

Okay, so Congress could pass a resolution saying they consider the dissolution of USAID a violation of the law… but the silence speaks for itself. The law is not what is written, the law is what we do and what we tolerate.

Re:TikTok is back in the App Store by ZeroGravitas on Friday February 14, 2025 @03:34AM (#43046193)
The billionaire doing the abolishing also called it a nest of Marxist vipers.

Really just the wild stuff that Elon and Trump post to their social media is terrifyingly unhinged. I feel most people get the sane-washed version via the media but it's genuinely mind boggling to read their directly published public comments about stuff.

Direct quote for the record:

> USAID was a viper’s nest of radical-left marxists who hate America

Re:TikTok is back in the App Store by actionfromafar on Friday February 14, 2025 @09:18AM (#43048518)
USAID changed overnight from a CIA front to a vipers nest of radical-left marxists. Maybe tomorrow, CIA are marxists too?
Re:TikTok is back in the App Store by km144 on Friday February 14, 2025 @01:40PM (#43051574)
Congress is also ignoring the principles laid out in the Constitution by acting like presidents have unilateral power when they do not, and were never intended to. Many members of Congress have defended Trump's actions on these issues by implying that voters gave him a mandate, but the voters also voted for Congress, and they are supposed to check the President in some ways. Congress is probably supposed to be the most impactful branch of federal government, not the weakest.
Re:TikTok is back in the App Store by macinjosh on Thursday February 13, 2025 @11:49PM (#43044948)
Obama, Trump and Biden have ignored federal cannabis laws for years. Laws and even the Constitution are ignored routinely Snowden showed us that.
Re:TikTok is back in the App Store by PaulDavisThe1st on Thursday February 13, 2025 @11:56PM (#43044987)
While this is true (to some degree anyway), it seems qualitatively different from Congress (and then backed up by SCOTUS) explicitly banning a specific company (and explicitly banning other companies from doing specific things related to that company) and then being completely ignored by an incoming president who just says "wut? no worries, carry on tiktok".

this is not a debate about just what the intelligence community can and cannot do, or what level of enforcement and in what communities is appropriate for a given law. it is a point blank statement "i am the president, and you (tiktok) and you (google, apple) can ignore the law", made in public, without any possible national security justification (whatever level of BS that might normally come with).

Re:TikTok is back in the App Store by macinjosh on Thursday February 13, 2025 @11:59PM (#43044998)
Biden refused to enforce the law as well.

Edit: you all are out here downvoting provable facts.

Re:TikTok is back in the App Store by PaulDavisThe1st on Friday February 14, 2025 @12:07AM (#43045042)
I'm not denying what Biden did (or did not do).

I'm noting that there is a qualititive difference in Trump's behavior with respect to this law compared with ... well, anything anyone has been comparing it to.

Re:TikTok is back in the App Store by noirbot on Friday February 14, 2025 @12:47AM (#43045261)
It's somewhat different to not enforce a general law against a multitude of possible targets and enforcing a law literally imposed against a single target.

A lot of people don't get fined for jaywalking and it's not a big deal because it's understood that it's a lot of work to actually cite all of them everywhere, so the difference between the normal level of not enforcing everything and intentionally not enforcing isn't 0 vs 100.

This is passing a law that John Smith should go to jail and then deciding you don't actually want to send him to jail. Why did you bother passing the law if you didn't care. Trump literally started all this TikTok banning stuff and now is against it, but isn't actually repealing the law. Congress seems to have just given up too. It's fully lawless.

Re:TikTok is back in the App Store by jajko on Friday February 14, 2025 @01:28AM (#43045488)
He is a servant of chaos to use fantasy terminology (due to lifelong mental imbalances that were glaringly obvious way before he got power). Maybe chaotic neutral after all + and - will eventually be summarised, but for now, for most of the world he veers towards evil scale.

Maybe something good will come out of this like Europe finally waking up, even now in 2025 here on HN I got attacked for warmongering if I dare say that we should increase defense (literally in our case) budgets.

Elephant in the porcelaine shop will make a room for new products for sure but thats not the most important thing that happens.

Re:TikTok is back in the App Store by jrflowers on Friday February 14, 2025 @02:14AM (#43045723)
The law went into effect on the last day of the Biden administration. If you are going to traffic in provable facts, “Biden declined to implement enforcement of a new law on his final day in office” is a more descriptive provable fact to share.
Re:TikTok is back in the App Store by kelnos on Friday February 14, 2025 @02:41AM (#43045895)
No, we're downvoting a bad-faith argument. Typical Trump-supporter nonsense, trying to equate Biden's and Trump's actions when they are qualitatively and quantitatively completely different.
Re:TikTok is back in the App Store by kannanvijayan on Friday February 14, 2025 @12:10AM (#43045054)
That's a very good point. There are certainly more examples of laws that go un-enforced to reinforce your point. For example jaywalking laws are routinely flouted with little enforcement. Likewise buggery laws are routinely ignored by law enforcement.

Along that axis, you are certainly right that it is basically the same as the president unilaterally choosing to exempt a specific multibillion dollar company controlled by a powerful foreign adversary from laws passed by congress with the intent of shoring up national security.

This insight is well received by me and I'm sure others.

Re:TikTok is back in the App Store by foogazi on Friday February 14, 2025 @12:27AM (#43045153)
Yeah, *whatabout* the other guys - they did this too!
Re:TikTok is back in the App Store by sudosysgen on Friday February 14, 2025 @01:04AM (#43045353)
The executive branch is explicitly granted the power to choose which drugs are or aren't scheduled. The law already having provisions to allow the executive to choose which drugs to ban or not makes the choice not to enforce very different qualitatively.
Re:TikTok is back in the App Store by shikon7 on Friday February 14, 2025 @01:17AM (#43045424)
What could Congress do? Make another law that might also be ignored?
Re:TikTok is back in the App Store by jazzyjackson on Friday February 14, 2025 @02:22AM (#43045768)
Just for completeness, Congress’ check on the executive and judicial is impeachment, but this check is somewhat defeated by party politics, a weakness President Washington was prescient enough to warn us about in his farewell address

The alternate domination of one faction over another, sharpened by the spirit of revenge, natural to party dissension, which in different ages and countries has perpetrated the most horrid enormities, is itself a frightful despotism. But this leads at length to a more formal and permanent despotism. The disorders and miseries, which result, gradually incline the minds of men to seek security and repose in the absolute power of an individual; and sooner or later the chief of some prevailing faction, more able or more fortunate than his competitors, turns this disposition to the purposes of his own elevation, on the ruins of Public Liberty.

Without looking forward to an extremity of this kind, (which nevertheless ought not to be entirely out of sight,) the common and continual mischiefs of the spirit of party are sufficient to make it the interest and duty of a wise people to discourage and restrain it.

It serves always to distract the Public Councils, and enfeeble the Public Administration. It agitates the Community with ill-founded jealousies and false alarms; kindles the animosity of one part against another, foments occasionally riot and insurrection. It opens the door to foreign influence and corruption, which find a facilitated access to the government itself through the channels of party passions. Thus the policy and the will of one country are subjected to the policy and will of another.

[0] https://www.mountvernon.org/education/primary-source-collect...

Re:TikTok is back in the App Store by personjerry on Friday February 14, 2025 @01:28AM (#43045493)
Isn't this a slippery slope into authoritarianism? How are people not more worried about this? The whole of checks and balances is this, this is democracy literally eroding away isn't it?
Re:TikTok is back in the App Store by jazzyjackson on Friday February 14, 2025 @02:20AM (#43045758)
We’re in the authoritarianism part already, the 3 branches are aligned on this. The democrats whole campaign this election was to worry , but they are too committed to process and impartiality to have any effect (and let’s face it, most of congress is too old and/or too rich to give a damn what happens to our democracy in the first place)
Re:TikTok is back in the App Store by prododev on Friday February 14, 2025 @01:58AM (#43045642)
Many of us made peace with this road a couple decades back and have been focused on building communities locally to survive it. Obama, Trump, Biden, GW ... they were all building the road to this moment together.

It's like watching one of those hydraulic press videos - the slow build up of the squeeze has been happening for awhile, we've finally arrived at the point where the pressure is really deforming stuff. But it was predictable for a long time.