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Re:Surrealism, cafes and lots (and lots) of cats: why Japane... by simgt on Tuesday November 26, 2024 @07:59AM (#42245312)
I don't know if that was your intention, but I basically understand from your comment that black men and powerful women are two components of reality that are bothering you to start with. Yes all new British and American productions are ticking these two boxes, but it's not shouting at all of us.

I suspect for the Japanese women who are putting in perspective the extreme conservatism on gender roles prevalent in their country, most Japanese fiction shouts at them about real life too.

Re:Surrealism, cafes and lots (and lots) of cats: why Japane... by Dalewyn on Tuesday November 26, 2024 @08:07AM (#42245377)
>I basically understand from your comment that black men and powerful women are two components of reality that are bothering you to start with.

They were just examples, I'm deeply annoyed at anything concerning acute political/social activism in entertainment because it's simply not what I wanted to spend my leisure time on.

Re:Surrealism, cafes and lots (and lots) of cats: why Japane... by makerdiety on Tuesday November 26, 2024 @08:17AM (#42245445)
Isn't being annoyed at something sociopolitical and expressing that feeling, sharing your concerns with anyone who will listen, itself a sociopolitical act?

Because it is.

I'm not trying to gaslight you, insofar as reason itself agrees with my proposition.

Re:Surrealism, cafes and lots (and lots) of cats: why Japane... by Dalewyn on Tuesday November 26, 2024 @08:26AM (#42245514)
I agree, it's a sociopolitical demand to stop shitting up my leisure time.

There's a good way and a bad way to have elements in entertainment. Using the "black man" example again, a good example are the Redguards in The Elder Scrolls games. I wasn't annoyed, the Redguards were a natural and very good part of the world building and lore and served to better entertain me.

A bad example on the other hand is literally any of the "obligatory black man" now seen everywhere. He doesn't serve any purpose other than to say that there's a black man.

I want more Redguards in my entertainment, not obligatory black men.

Re:Surrealism, cafes and lots (and lots) of cats: why Japane... by makerdiety on Tuesday November 26, 2024 @08:50AM (#42245699)
I'm not Elon Musk or Donald Trump. Sending your complaints of mainstream culture to me will not result in your political representation and its voice being heard. I am unable to effectively sponsor and defend your proposed alternative dynamics.

But! If I am like a techno-angel sent from the Heavens above, then what I can do is suggest to you that exit, as opposed to voice, is a sociopolitical act that you should consider. Exit from the mainstream culture is your best bet.

Re:Surrealism, cafes and lots (and lots) of cats: why Japane... by morkalork on Tuesday November 26, 2024 @09:11AM (#42245901)
The token characters and checkboxes are a symptom of design-by-committee corporate culture anyways and even without them, the quality isn't going to be any better because again, it's corporate slop.
Re:Surrealism, cafes and lots (and lots) of cats: why Japane... by makerdiety on Tuesday November 26, 2024 @09:22AM (#42246001)
This only means that there's a pervasive cultural synagogue/cathedral that has infected behavior through pedagogical means. Namely, education itself has been made to serve the interests of all possible economics that can occur within the borders of global liberal democracy.

This also only means that any sociopolitical exit from the zombie invasion must at least be as high as considering a departure from common epistemology.

Re:Surrealism, cafes and lots (and lots) of cats: why Japane... by scarmig on Tuesday November 26, 2024 @10:46AM (#42246745)
Imagine a world where literature was preoccupied with height. A character is always slotted in who's explicitly the token short character, and the storyline is always, subtly or not, written to highlight how the world is biased against short people. Authors are very cautious about depicting a short person with any negative trait; when they do, a direct line is drawn between the social circumstances they encountered and their future actions.

This would be exhausting, and people would rightly start to roll their eyes at it. And it would be fine for readers to object to it, even as short people are a component of reality. It wouldn't mean the complainant finds short people objectionable in themselves, but simply that they don't think height is a defining part of reality that all of literature is obligated to address.

Re:Surrealism, cafes and lots (and lots) of cats: why Japane... by simgt on Tuesday November 26, 2024 @11:35AM (#42247136)
> Imagine a world where literature was preoccupied with height.

Smart of you to have picked one of the few human characteristics that hasn't been used to justify discriminations and very unfortunate historical events... In our world it's not just literature that is very preoccupied with skin colour and gender.

> It wouldn't mean the complainant finds short people objectionable in themselves, but simply that they don't think height is a defining part of reality that all of literature is obligated to address.

You have it reversed, if it's not a defining part of someone's reality, why would one even care whether it's addressed in fiction or not? The person I was answering to does care, a lot, to the point that swinging one way or another can ruin their experience.

Re:Surrealism, cafes and lots (and lots) of cats: why Japane... by scarmig on Tuesday November 26, 2024 @12:02PM (#42247449)
Not getting into how we define what are valid complaints vs invalid, because that's besides the point.

You'd find it exhausting. People similarly find the race and gender preoccupation exhausting. Your justification for the different treatment seems to be "for these categories, people are obligated to not find them exhausting, but not for other categories." But that's not well-motivated.

In a height-preoccupied literary world, can you imagine objecting to the height preoccupation? If you did, how could you justify it, if it's not a defining part of your existence?

Re:Surrealism, cafes and lots (and lots) of cats: why Japane... by PrismCrystal on Tuesday November 26, 2024 @11:47AM (#42247254)
"one of the few human characteristics that hasn't been used to justify discriminations"

Of course it has. That notions like “Napoleon complex” circulate in pop culture, suggests that society broadly considers short-statured people to be somehow disadvantaged and, moreover, it can be funny when the short-statured kick against the pricks. The demand that a suitable male partner ought to be over six feet tall, is absolutely widespread, both in match-seeking profiles on online-dating platforms and in dating fora where women give advice to each other. (Or, if you want to reverse the sexes, Truffaut’s gag in Baisers volés about dating a tall girl, wouldn’t work if people broadly didn’t feel that there was something weird about this.)

Re:Surrealism, cafes and lots (and lots) of cats: why Japane... by ValentinA23 on Tuesday November 26, 2024 @12:11PM (#42247542)
>I suspect for the Japanese women who are putting in perspective the extreme conservatism on gender roles prevalent in their country, most Japanese fiction shouts at them about real life too.

https://www.bbc.com/news/business-19674306

The 15th of each month is a big day for 36-year-old Yoshihiro Nozawa: it is the day he gets paid.

But every month, he hands over his entire salary to his wife Masami.

She controls the household budget and gives him a monthly pocket money of 30,000 yen ($381; £243). Despite being the breadwinner, that is all the money he can spend on himself over the next 30 days.

"The last five days from the 10th of each month are usually the toughest," says Yoshihiro.

[...]

47-year-old Taisaku Kubo has been getting 50,000 yen a month from his wife Yuriko for the past 15 years.

He has tried to negotiate a pay rise each year but his wife makes a presentation to explain why it cannot be done.

"She draws a pie chart of our household budget to explain why I cannot get more pocket money," says Taisaku.

[...]

So why don't men start controlling the household budgets themselves?

"I don't think many men hand over their entire salaries happily," says career consultant Takao Maekawa of FeelWorks.

"But they feel it's their obligation to earn money for the family even if it means they have to suffer themselves."