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Re:Homebound: The Long-Term Rise in Time Spent at Home Among... by janalsncm on Monday August 19, 2024 @01:51PM (#41293099)
Is this not explained by remote work? Some portion of adults who used to spend ~50 hours at an office and commuting are spending it at home.
Re:Homebound: The Long-Term Rise in Time Spent at Home Among... by nox101 on Monday August 19, 2024 @02:37PM (#41293546)
For me it's explained by

(1) less shopping because I order online

(2) more entertainment/distraction from online stuff (movies, youtube, tech news, anime, streamers, ....)

(3) less office friends IMO partly because WFH. It's not that I'm spending time at home because I working, it's that I'm not going out with co-workers after work because we aren't starting the evening together like we used to.

(3b) Same as above, I'm already at home because WFH so it's an effort to "go out". Where as when it was WFO I'd already be "out" and then stay out somewhere before coming home.

Honestly I hate WFH. I know it's not coming back but "my" life is definitely worse because of WFH. I get that that's not true for many others.

Re:Homebound: The Long-Term Rise in Time Spent at Home Among... by SoftTalker on Monday August 19, 2024 @03:52PM (#41294088)
> going out with co-workers after work

Is this really a common thing? Because I've never experienced it in over 30 years of professional work. Going out to lunch? Yes. But at 5:00 everyone goes their separate ways.

Re:Homebound: The Long-Term Rise in Time Spent at Home Among... by throwaway22032 on Tuesday August 20, 2024 @10:37AM (#41300493)
WFH is fast food.

It's more convenient and cheaper but worse for you.

Re:Homebound: The Long-Term Rise in Time Spent at Home Among... by phelddagrif on Wednesday August 21, 2024 @08:11AM (#41309467)
yes the extra 2 hours a day I get to spend with my wife and children is terrible for me. it's so obvious now.
Re:Homebound: The Long-Term Rise in Time Spent at Home Among... by i_read_news on Monday August 19, 2024 @01:57PM (#41293155)
That’s a factor, but there are other reasons. Saving money, more online entertainment, the general shift of things done in person are now online, and the dark patterns that keep us tied there.
Re:Homebound: The Long-Term Rise in Time Spent at Home Among... by VancouverMan on Monday August 19, 2024 @02:14PM (#41293336)
A lot of formerly-enjoyable leisure activities outside the home have become a lot loss fun over the last few decades, too.

I know a lot of people in the US, and especially Canada, who've stopped going to restaurants for example. They now cost too much, the food is often mediocre or even outright bad, the service is often terrible, parking can be an issue in some cities, and it's generally a miserable experience. Cooking at home, even if takes more effort, ends up being comparatively more enjoyable.

That's also the case for movies, concerts, sporting events, exhibitions, and tourist venues. The tickets cost a lot relative to the enjoyment that's provided, and the pricing of food and drinks at such events can be astronomical. It has just become prohibitively expensive, especially for families, in addition to the other inconveniences (such as travel and parking) that can be associated with such events.

Even something as simple as going to a beach or a lake has become an awful experience in Canada. A problem at Canadian beaches has been foreigners defecating in the sand, rather than using the proper washroom facilities. Even when that isn't happening, such places can be quite crowded and nowhere near as fun as they were in the past when they were quieter.

I certainly can't blame people for not wanting to subject themselves to unpleasant experiences like those.

Re:Homebound: The Long-Term Rise in Time Spent at Home Among... by actionfromafar on Monday August 19, 2024 @02:30PM (#41293475)
I am sorry, the rest of what you said resonates, but I must point out how funny it is that nobody goes to the beach anymore, it's too crowded. :-)
Re:Homebound: The Long-Term Rise in Time Spent at Home Among... by charlie0 on Monday August 19, 2024 @04:54PM (#41294501)
lol, this so true and it keeps from visiting certain places. You just know it's going to be either circling around for 20 minutes or more trying to find parking, or parking really far away and then having to carry everything to the beach which may not even be possible to do on a single trip.
Re:Homebound: The Long-Term Rise in Time Spent at Home Among... by vel0city on Tuesday August 20, 2024 @11:40AM (#41301051)
TBH though some of their other examples like sporting events and concerts are similarly tied to this. It's too expensive so nobody goes. Except the tickets still sell very well, and the stadiums are still largely full despite the higher concession and ticket prices.

Restaurants are too expensive, so everyone eats at home. And yet it's still hard to get reservations at many places and drive through lines circle the buildings.

Its stupid expensive to go to a Disney park these days. Think those places are empty?

Re:Homebound: The Long-Term Rise in Time Spent at Home Among... by beaglesss on Monday August 19, 2024 @02:25PM (#41293423)
When my parents wanted to go out they did, and if I didn't want to I went down the creek, biked to the store, ran around the neighborhood with friends or whatever.

Now that earns a call from CPS and the parents are arrested and the kid may end up in a foster home which are common sources of abuse. So the family just stays home if the kids won't/can't be taken.

Re:Homebound: The Long-Term Rise in Time Spent at Home Among... by Terr_ on Monday August 19, 2024 @03:09PM (#41293788)
I've seen the narrative before and I agree that parenting attitudes have changed, but are there any stats/studies to show that kind of severe outcome has really become more common over the decades? (As opposed to simply more-feared.)
Re:Homebound: The Long-Term Rise in Time Spent at Home Among... by bilegeek on Monday August 19, 2024 @03:45PM (#41294033)
Re:Homebound: The Long-Term Rise in Time Spent at Home Among... by beaglesss on Monday August 19, 2024 @10:17PM (#41296177)
Most the cases are sealed and depend on self reporting to the media by parents who do so at great threat of it impacting their secret proceedings, where you cannot even face the accuser.

By design they've made such studies effectively impossible from the outside. You don't even get a jury. So we're left with the odd anecdotes (as exemplified below in sister comment)from those who weren't successfully intimidated.

And that's the beauty. They can knowingly and willingly intimidate parents while screeching "but muh data, you can't prove it" laughing all along by design they've hidden the data in the shadows from inspection.

Re:Homebound: The Long-Term Rise in Time Spent at Home Among... by Terr_ on Tuesday August 20, 2024 @01:34AM (#41297109)
Yet surely the number of cases and broad outcomes are at least countable, even if identities and specifics are not available, right? For example, like in this piece [0]:

> That study was based on an analysis of [...] the Adoption and Foster Care Analysis and Reporting System, which provides information on removals of children from home, terminations of parental rights and adoptions.

From there with a little searching I find this graph [1] showing various metrics from 2013-2022, which don't appear to show any freakish growth over that decade.

[0] https://www.propublica.org/article/how-we-analyzed-child-wel...

[1] https://www.acf.hhs.gov/cb/report/trends-foster-care-adoptio...

Re:Homebound: The Long-Term Rise in Time Spent at Home Among... by janalsncm on Tuesday August 20, 2024 @12:50PM (#41301666)
The flip side is you are claiming CPS is over-reaching but conveniently can’t provide any evidence of it.
Re:Homebound: The Long-Term Rise in Time Spent at Home Among... by frumper on Monday August 19, 2024 @04:33PM (#41294353)
Anyone can call CPS as many times as they want and they will investigate, but no one is putting kids in foster care for biking to the store unless there are other things going on.
Re:Homebound: The Long-Term Rise in Time Spent at Home Among... by bluGill on Monday August 19, 2024 @06:04PM (#41294937)
The annoyance of being investigated is enough to make parents so no to biking.
Re:Homebound: The Long-Term Rise in Time Spent at Home Among... by janalsncm on Tuesday August 20, 2024 @12:44PM (#41301619)
Are you saying this from personal experience? Because it sounds like you’re spreading an urban legend. Parents aren’t being investigated for kids biking around. CPS is way too busy for that.

I have relatives who work for CPS and if anything they are extremely lenient. And even if they take kids (when both parents can’t take care of the kid for example if they’re both heroin addicts) CPS will try to place with a relative, even out of state.

Re:Homebound: The Long-Term Rise in Time Spent at Home Among... by bluGill on Tuesday August 20, 2024 @02:06PM (#41302400)
I've been investigated. They did the mandatory interview and closed it, but still annoying.
Re:Homebound: The Long-Term Rise in Time Spent at Home Among... by janalsncm on Tuesday August 20, 2024 @12:48PM (#41301653)
What you are describing is essentially an urban legend. Parents are not being investigated for letting kids bike around.

Also, the most common source of child abuse is a family member, which unfortunately is a common reason for CPS to get involved.

Re:Homebound: The Long-Term Rise in Time Spent at Home Among... by beaglesss on Wednesday August 21, 2024 @08:42AM (#41309709)
Sure if you ignore all the examples of it happening, after you so rudely lied about in your other reply where you claimed I cited no evidence despite citing sister comment that included articles such as children being taken into cps custody for walking home alone from the park.

Of course the genius is the kidnappers seal most these cases so their relatives can gaslight you about what happened, which is the icing on the cake.

Re:Homebound: The Long-Term Rise in Time Spent at Home Among... by frumper on Wednesday August 21, 2024 @10:42AM (#41310795)
Did you click through them? Only 1 sounds like a simple case of a parent letting kids out to play and CPS taking any action, and cites several people in that community claiming the CPS response as irresponsible. A few of those links are about a law specifically protecting parents rights to allow children to go play at a park unsupervised.
Re:Homebound: The Long-Term Rise in Time Spent at Home Among... by mikehodgson on Monday August 19, 2024 @02:39PM (#41293565)
The rumours about some great number of foreigners pooping on the beach are generated to create resentment against a certain part of the population. They come from the same place as the "litter boxes in school washrooms" rumour from last summer. It isn't something that is actually happening.
Re:Homebound: The Long-Term Rise in Time Spent at Home Among... by VancouverMan on Tuesday August 20, 2024 @10:52AM (#41300618)
That recent Wasaga Beach controversy didn't come as a surprise to me, since what was described there corresponded well enough with what I've heard from a number of other people in various places in Ontario, BC, and even other regions over the past eight to ten years.

What was described there is also not far off from the other unsanitary practices and obnoxious behaviour I've personally seen arise over that period of time.

Considering what I've heard and seen over the years, I don't have any reason to doubt those latest claims. They sound quite plausible.

Re:Homebound: The Long-Term Rise in Time Spent at Home Among... by MattGaiser on Monday August 19, 2024 @02:25PM (#41293431)
Options have also expanded.

The options are also not cooking at home vs going to a restaurant. There is now food delivery. It used to be that the only way to get ribs was to make them yourself or go to a restaurant and order them. But now a majority of my rib consumption is via Uber Eats.

Movies used to be either in a theatre or a grainy home screen. The home screen is no longer grainy. Same with sports. You have to want the atmosphere to go to a game now.

Beaches being crowded indicates use, so I wouldn't put it into the category of restaurant visits, movies, and sports, which are all declining categories overall.

Re:Homebound: The Long-Term Rise in Time Spent at Home Among... by freeone3000 on Monday August 19, 2024 @03:59PM (#41294135)
We have a lot more people but the same amount of beach — even if people spend more total time at the beach, on average every person goes less often.
Re:Homebound: The Long-Term Rise in Time Spent at Home Among... by shiroiushi on Monday August 19, 2024 @09:43PM (#41296058)
>Movies used to be either in a theatre or a grainy home screen. The home screen is no longer grainy.

Yes, and it's actually better than going to a theater in most ways:

1) You can pause and go to the bathroom when you need to, instead of holding it and being miserable and then rushing to the crowded bathroom when the credits roll, or going during the movie and missing important plot points.

2) You can rewind it if you missed some important dialog.

3) You can turn on subtitling so you can understand all the dialog, in case your hearing isn't great, or the actors are mumbling as is common these days.

4) You can eat/drink whatever you want, and it costs only whatever your grocery store charges.

5) You can pause the movie and talk to your friend/SO about it.

6) You can put your feet all the way up with your recliner.

7) You can adjust the volume to whatever you like, so you don't have to listen to it deafeningly-loud as is common in theaters now.

8) You don't have to deal with some stupid stranger using their phone or talking loudly to their friends, or having their head block your view.

9) You don't have to worry about a retired cop shooting you.

Re:Homebound: The Long-Term Rise in Time Spent at Home Among... by janalsncm on Tuesday August 20, 2024 @12:54PM (#41301701)
It’s also way cleaner at home.

Movie theaters are probably going the way of the dodo. That doesn’t mean all outside activities are doomed. There’s just a higher bar. Entrepreneurs will have to focus on experiences people can’t get at home and make them accessible and affordable.

Re:Homebound: The Long-Term Rise in Time Spent at Home Among... by charlie0 on Monday August 19, 2024 @04:49PM (#41294463)
It's not even just about the cost though. I understand there's inflation and I like to help out the mom/pop restaurants survive. I'm willing to pay extra as long at the food is good, but what I notice (at some places) the turnover is very high leading to inconsistent food quality. Sometimes the food is great, then I go back 2 weeks later and the food is awful. There are some places I visit every month and I don't recognize anyone from the last time I was there and it's like that frequently. Can't keep paying high prices and then rolling the dice on whether the food is going to be good.

On the flip side, I've noticed that restaurants with great quality almost invariably have low turnover and those are the one I keep coming back to.

Re:Homebound: The Long-Term Rise in Time Spent at Home Among... by zem on Monday August 19, 2024 @01:59PM (#41293178)
also the increasing unavailability and/or inviability of third spaces where you can just hang out without having to spend a ton of money and deal with unpleasant environments
Re:Homebound: The Long-Term Rise in Time Spent at Home Among... by mjyoon on Monday August 19, 2024 @02:16PM (#41293360)
I don't buy this - there are third spaces where you don't need to spend money and they've been here forever and are usually accessible. Churches, libraries, parks, certain community recreational facilities, gyms ,etc. It's not a lack of spaces, it's an issue of getting to those spaces.
Re:Homebound: The Long-Term Rise in Time Spent at Home Among... by 3523582908 on Monday August 19, 2024 @02:29PM (#41293468)
I'm spending the summer in Canada, where they invest a lot in third spaces, and the difference between Canada and the US in this regard is night and day.

- Parks: A lot of them, every few blocks there's a large, well maintained park. Trash cans everywhere. - Many community centers, huge, filled with extremely inexpensive or free activities. Community centers all have gyms in them. - Beautiful, modern feeling libraries

It's hard to describe the difference, but it is non trivial.

Re:Homebound: The Long-Term Rise in Time Spent at Home Among... by vel0city on Monday August 19, 2024 @04:54PM (#41294502)
I'm in the US. I've spent time visiting in Canada recently as well.

Everything in your list is stuff I experienced in most of the parts of Canada I visited. Not all though, for instance it wasn't like that in the parts of Mississauga I visited. And everything in your list is stuff I experience regularly in the US, in the parts I've lived in.

Re:Homebound: The Long-Term Rise in Time Spent at Home Among... by arccy on Monday August 19, 2024 @02:20PM (#41293390)

  - churches: not really for the non religious
  - libraries: not if you want to actually talk to people
  - parks: only if the weather cooperates
  - certain community recreational facilities: spend money? too activity oriented
  - gyms: same as above
Re:Homebound: The Long-Term Rise in Time Spent at Home Among... by 01HNNWZ0MV43FF on Monday August 19, 2024 @04:10PM (#41294199)
We could agree that libraries don't have to be quiet anymore. It's not perfect but it's easy, and then a bunch of towns would suddenly have really nice public community centers.
Re:Homebound: The Long-Term Rise in Time Spent at Home Among... by mjyoon on Monday August 19, 2024 @02:38PM (#41293552)
The original poster said "spend a ton of money" (those places you spend money but not a "ton") and I've included churches as an example. This short list isn't comprehensive. Also, have you been to a library recently? There are now spaces where you can socialize and meet.
Re:Homebound: The Long-Term Rise in Time Spent at Home Among... by shiroiushi on Monday August 19, 2024 @09:46PM (#41296068)
>The original poster said "spend a ton of money" (those places you spend money but not a "ton")

Then why'd you put gyms in your list? You DO have to spend a ton of money to get a gym membership. And you can't cancel it because you have to sign a ridiculous contract and basically file a lawsuit to end the membership (not really, but it seems almost this bad).

Re:Homebound: The Long-Term Rise in Time Spent at Home Among... by vel0city on Tuesday August 20, 2024 @11:47AM (#41301104)
> You DO have to spend a ton of money to get a gym membership.

I've been off and on user of several different gyms over the years. I don't recall actually paying for a gym membership myself. It's usually been a gym at my apartment complex, or a gym at the office park where I work, or my employer covered a gym membership, or I got it through health insurance.

Re:Homebound: The Long-Term Rise in Time Spent at Home Among... by MattGaiser on Monday August 19, 2024 @02:18PM (#41293376)
Anecdotally, several managers of such spaces tell me they are dying from lack of use.

I know my parents used them, but I never did. My friends used them a bit in university but stopped once they could afford something different. My local community centre's calendar has dried up, despite the space still being there. New neighborhoods sometimes don't even bother to build one now where I am, as there is no demand.

Nobody demolished the churches or the libraries, but they have rapidly aging user bases. Rotary and other similar social clubs would love younger members, but younger people don't want them.

Re:Homebound: The Long-Term Rise in Time Spent at Home Among... by msds on Monday August 19, 2024 @08:15PM (#41295619)
As a consequence of the aging members, a lot of churches (particularly the less virulent mainstream protestant flavor) around here are merging congregations and getting demolished, to be replaced with more apartment buildings. Sometimes the parishioners will fight the good fight and get concessions made for affordable housing or other social goods.
Re:Homebound: The Long-Term Rise in Time Spent at Home Among... by bpodgursky on Monday August 19, 2024 @02:06PM (#41293255)
I really don't think this is the reason. Third places are demand-driven, there are a lot of places where a $2 coffee buys you an afternoon. People aren't bothering.
Re:Homebound: The Long-Term Rise in Time Spent at Home Among... by pavel_lishin on Monday August 19, 2024 @02:13PM (#41293328)
> there are a lot of places where a $2 coffee buys you an afternoon.

But there also isn't much reason to go there if nobody else does. A weird network-effect thing, right? Like, I didn't bother walking down to the local Chilean bakery that serves food because it's mostly empty most of the time, and there's only so much I can chat to the folks working there about as a stranger who lives down the street.

Re:Homebound: The Long-Term Rise in Time Spent at Home Among... by chubot on Monday August 19, 2024 @03:01PM (#41293713)
You used US dollars as your unit, but I don’t think there’s anywhere in the US where coffee cost $2 anymore

Granted I live in more expensive areas, but still

Re:Homebound: The Long-Term Rise in Time Spent at Home Among... by mlinhares on Monday August 19, 2024 @02:42PM (#41293592)
They're not, they're made, just look at all the open streets projects happening all over the world, and specially in Europe. You need people activelly building these third places for them to exist and for people to go there.

The US is building most of its new homes in anti-social car controlled environments, where you can't walk anywhere, everything has to be done by driving. Kids can't just roam the neighborhoods anymore and when they do people start asking if they should call the cops.

We are sick and it doesn't look like there is much thinking in how to fix it.

Re:Homebound: The Long-Term Rise in Time Spent at Home Among... by ricksunny on Monday August 19, 2024 @02:00PM (#41293186)
Which particular dark patterns would you be referring to? Sounds intriguing, and the article doesn't mention dark patterns.
Re:Homebound: The Long-Term Rise in Time Spent at Home Among... by i_read_news on Monday August 19, 2024 @02:06PM (#41293260)
That’s my own take, not actual direct causation. But for example, I’ve experienced and witnessed time taken by endless scrolling design (I.e. TikTok) which could have been spent socially. Since I’ve take time away from such apps with patterns, I feel generally more content, but results may vary.
Re:Homebound: The Long-Term Rise in Time Spent at Home Among... by toomuchtodo on Monday August 19, 2024 @02:04PM (#41293232)
Why go out if home is more comfortable?