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Re:How French Drains Work by chiph on Wednesday August 07, 2024 @05:05PM (#41185509)
20+ years ago, I had moved into a newly built home. And the first serious rain we got, I had water come into the living room (flooded the porch and seeped under the door). There was no insurance coverage since it was "surface water" and thus excluded. So I had to use a shop-vac and rent a couple of blowers to dry it out.

There was a ditch out back but it obviously wasn't deep enough. I did the math and ended up with an astounding amount of water flowing by (something like 20,000 gallons per minute[0]) and complained to the builder about it. They sent a couple of guys out there who installed two 4" corrugated drainage pipes and said it was good enough.

When the next big rain happened, where those pipes emptied out there was a 3 foot tall fountain of water from the pressure. It was an amateur Bellagio, lol. The yard still flooded but luckily didn't come into the house again.

Since then, the landscaping came in throughout the neighborhood which controlled the runoff. But it taught me a lot of respect for getting slopes & drains right - Always use a larger pipe than you think you'll need.

[0] The formula seems to be: V = 0.408 × Q/(D^2) where V is velocity in feet-per-second, Q is the flow rate in gallons-per-minute, and D is the diameter of the pipe in inches. I estimated the diameter based on the land profile that was underwater, and timed the velocity by following twigs/leaves floating by.

Re:How French Drains Work by SonOfLilit on Wednesday August 07, 2024 @06:50PM (#41186340)
You probably got a bit higher number than the true one, because water flows faster the farther it is from the floor/wall, and leaves float so they move like the fastest water, not the average water.
Re:How French Drains Work by 486sx33 on Wednesday August 07, 2024 @07:45PM (#41186673)
This is called “overland water” and “overland water coverage” in insurance speak. It is usually not even offered as additional coverage.
Re:How French Drains Work by alliao on Thursday August 08, 2024 @05:23AM (#41189563)
I've visited Lloyd's Building on a building tour once, and seeing the scale and sheer floors of actuaries with PhDs in god knows what domain made me a firm believer in the real life prowess of the insurance industry. I honestly don't think consumer insurance is worthwhile, but commercial definitely if you have an equally capable team of actuaries to run the numbers and they stack up to cover the risks involved.
Re:How French Drains Work by RandomThoughts3 on Thursday August 08, 2024 @05:47AM (#41189713)
Sure but all these people are there to ensure the insurance will get ahead, not to help the customers.

One of my friend works in reinsurance and his favourite joke is that every time the insurance company pays a claim, someone is getting fired. Obviously a joke but it seems to paint a fairly accurate picture of how the business is run.

Re:How French Drains Work by throwaway2037 on Thursday August 08, 2024 @07:27AM (#41190306)
As I understand, a lot of property and casualty insurance companies are structed as "mutuals" (not sure the exact term). And, most of the annual profit is refunded to customers. They are basically run as non-profits.
Re:How French Drains Work by zie on Thursday August 08, 2024 @01:41PM (#41194210)
Technically true, but the people in charge are not the customers. The people in charge(C-Suite) have zero incentive to ever refund any annual profit. They have all the incentives in the world to ensure their compensation just happens to suck up any and all annual profits. Who is going to stop them?

Vanguard(the brokerage) is structured the same way pretty much, except it's the various mutual funds(like VTSAX/VTI) that own the larger corporation. So far the infection of c-suite salaries continually growing larger and larger hasn't gotten to Vanguard yet, but they are now a few CEO's removed from the original founder(Jack Bogle), so it's probably about time that shift starts to happen.

Re:How French Drains Work by throwaway2037 on Monday August 19, 2024 @10:42AM (#41291481)

    > The people in charge(C-Suite) have zero incentive to ever refund any annual profit.
This makes no sense. Well run mutuals regularly refund part of insurance premiums each year.

For example, in 2020:

    > USAA, the country’s fifth largest property-casualty insurer, will be returning $520 million to its members.
Ref: https://newsroom.usaa360.com/news/usaa-to-return-usd-520-mil...

If what you say is true, why did they return any money at all? They could easily pay that to C-suite and senior execs in huge bonuses.

Also, to clarify, the correct term is "mutual insurance", which Wiki describes as:

    > A mutual insurance company is an insurance company owned entirely by its policyholders. It is a form of consumers' co-operative. Any profits earned by a mutual insurance company are either retained within the company or rebated to policyholders in the form of dividend distributions or reduced future premiums.
Ref: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mutual_insurance
Re:How French Drains Work by toast0 on Saturday August 10, 2024 @12:39PM (#41210633)
A lot of insurance companies have caps on profit, either as part of their structure or by regulation. Often the cap is structured as a percentage above covered losses, so administrative costs, including executive salary expense are effectively limited. In health insurance, this can lead to cost inflation, but I haven't really seen that in home and auto --- the market of service providers is so different.

Certainly, they're in business to make money, and helping customers is just part of the process, not their goal.

But --- it's in the customers' interest for the company to be accurate about accepting and denying claims. If the company accepts claims that should be denied, that means higher premiums. If the company denies claims that should have been paid, that may result in the company having to pay those claims after appeal/lawsuit and possibly with penalties; penalties get paid by the pooled insureds one way or another.

Insurance fills a need and is not just an evil company doing evil. Most insurance covers risks of loss that the insured would be unable or unwilling or at least unhappy to cover themselves. For most homeowners, if their house burns down, they would be unable to rebuild without insurance, unless there was clear liability from a person or company with big pockets.

Re:How French Drains Work by throwaway2037 on Thursday August 08, 2024 @07:25AM (#41190288)

    > I honestly don't think consumer insurance is worthwhile
So no fire insurance on your house?
Re:How French Drains Work by chiph on Thursday August 08, 2024 @05:03PM (#41196242)
From what I've observed, if the insurance company uses a mascot of any kind, you will have difficulties in getting them to pay a claim.

This is consumer insurance, so your typical auto, home, renter's, etc. policies. If you need commercial or E&O coverage, ask your broker to check them against the AM Best rating list.

Re:How French Drains Work by chiph on Thursday August 08, 2024 @04:55PM (#41196153)
I checked my policy and they use the "surface water" term. So it's probably something that varies by company and perhaps region.

To get a flood policy you would have to speak to a broker about whether you qualify for the National Flood Insurance Program. They won't issue a policy to you directly.