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Re:Apple to 'Pay' OpenAI for ChatGPT Through Distribution, N... by aurareturn on Thursday June 13, 2024 @05:20AM (#40667541)
It sort of makes sense but can be risky for OpenAI. I suspect that there are limits to this deal. For example, Apple will pay x amount if conversion rate is lower than x.

You're adding a few billion devices to do inference for if you're OpenAI without knowing the conversion rate from free to paid ChatGPT accounts from Apple users.

Also, can OpenAI really handle that much more traffic? Sometimes my paid ChatGPT account stalls or is slow even as of June 2024. Now they're going to add a few billion more users/devices at once. That's insane. How are they going to do this?

Re:Apple to 'Pay' OpenAI for ChatGPT Through Distribution, N... by rpgbr on Thursday June 13, 2024 @05:41AM (#40667642)
Not billion(s), because Apple Intelligence will only work on Apple Silicon (Mx) Mac and iPad and iPhone 15 Pro. Also, initially only in en_US devices.

I’ve heard 100 mi figure, but can’t confirm/remember where.

Re:Apple to 'Pay' OpenAI for ChatGPT Through Distribution, N... by quenix on Thursday June 13, 2024 @06:18AM (#40667853)
There are three models:

1. Apple On-Device

2. Apple Server

3. GPT-4o

Apple Silicon/Mx, iPad, iPhone 15 Pro can access all three.

All other devices can still access Apple Server and GPT-4o. So, I'd expect the incompatible devices to actually hammer OpenAI more.

Re:Apple to 'Pay' OpenAI for ChatGPT Through Distribution, N... by abhinavk on Thursday June 13, 2024 @06:35AM (#40667946)
Other devices are not getting Apple Intelligence.
Re:Apple to 'Pay' OpenAI for ChatGPT Through Distribution, N... by ilogik on Thursday June 13, 2024 @07:19AM (#40668206)
Apple Intelligence doesn't use OpenAI
Re:Apple to 'Pay' OpenAI for ChatGPT Through Distribution, N... by cassianoleal on Thursday June 13, 2024 @10:43AM (#40670327)
> As a result of the company's partnership with OpenAI, Apple Intelligence includes an integration with ChatGPT, allowing Siri to determine when to send certain complex user requests to ChatGPT.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Apple_Intelligence

Re:Apple to 'Pay' OpenAI for ChatGPT Through Distribution, N... by fckgw on Thursday June 13, 2024 @03:54PM (#40673905)
OpenAI does not power Apple Intelligence. Apple Intelligence will pass of queries to OpenAI (with explicit user permission) in certain circumstances where it feels OpenAI would have a better answer.
Re:Apple to 'Pay' OpenAI for ChatGPT Through Distribution, N... by cassianoleal on Friday June 14, 2024 @08:07AM (#40680071)
> OpenAI does not power Apple Intelligence.

This is a strawman. No one on this thread said it does.

That said, it does - even if only partially, even if only with explicit permission, even if only in certain circumstances.

Re:Apple to 'Pay' OpenAI for ChatGPT Through Distribution, N... by talldayo on Friday June 14, 2024 @09:56AM (#40680940)
Acceptance is the first step in grieving the loss of a beloved business.
Re:Apple to 'Pay' OpenAI for ChatGPT Through Distribution, N... by aurareturn on Thursday June 13, 2024 @05:53AM (#40667709)
Do Siri queries not fall back to GPT4o in older devices? That seems weird because the inference is done in the cloud.

But 100m figure seems small. There are ~100m Apple Silicon Macs sold in the last 4 years. That's not including any M1+ iPads or iPhone 15 Pros.

I'm guessing maybe 250m? Still a ton of queries and usage. It's not just Siri. I believe features like optimize email response also uses GPT4o.

Re:Apple to 'Pay' OpenAI for ChatGPT Through Distribution, N... by blixt on Thursday June 13, 2024 @08:01AM (#40668581)
They’ve been explicit that only some knowledge related requests get sent to OpenAI, and only after the user has been asked “ok to send this to ChatGPT?”

If they allowed your private email contents or any other private context to leak outside their encrypted enclave (local or their new online hardware) then the entire set of privacy claims would go out the window.

Re:Apple to 'Pay' OpenAI for ChatGPT Through Distribution, N... by jitl on Thursday June 13, 2024 @07:15AM (#40668169)
Email, etc, is all Apple inference, the presentation strongly implied that was on-device. The system always explicitly asks “Ok to send this query to OpenAI?” or user imitated request.

I think the Apple server inference is handling things like image generation where you need a beefy guy to get results quickly, and don’t need to transmit as much user context to service the request.

Re:Apple to 'Pay' OpenAI for ChatGPT Through Distribution, N... by aurareturn on Thursday June 13, 2024 @07:55AM (#40668521)
I'm pretty sure there is an option to ask ChatGPT to do inferencing for Email, etc.

If I'm a paid ChatGPT user, I'd definitely choose GPT4 over Apple's models.

Re:Apple to 'Pay' OpenAI for ChatGPT Through Distribution, N... by slipheen on Thursday June 13, 2024 @05:16PM (#40674875)
There isn't anything like that currently - The integration that's been announced/shown is more like the current fallback in Siri of "Would you like me to Google that for you?"
Re:Apple to 'Pay' OpenAI for ChatGPT Through Distribution, N... by Aerbil313 on Thursday June 13, 2024 @08:03PM (#40676227)
No, there is - from official Apple Intelligence announcement:

> With ChatGPT from OpenAI integrated into Siri and Writing Tools, you get even more expertise when it might be helpful for you — no need to jump between tools. Siri can tap into ChatGPT for certain requests, including questions about photos or documents. And with Compose in Writing Tools, you can create and illustrate original content from scratch.

https://www.apple.com/apple-intelligence/

Re:Apple to 'Pay' OpenAI for ChatGPT Through Distribution, N... by aurareturn on Friday June 14, 2024 @12:56AM (#40677594)
I watched WWDC and clearly, GPT4 is an option for inferencing email/text at the OS level. It's not just Siri fallback.
Re:Apple to 'Pay' OpenAI for ChatGPT Through Distribution, N... by ben_w on Thursday June 13, 2024 @06:21AM (#40667868)
Sure, but they're not all en_US. I've got three on my desk right now*, and I'm in Germany.

* got one of my own right before a previous employer closed down and let us keep the work one, third one is from new employer

Re:Apple to 'Pay' OpenAI for ChatGPT Through Distribution, N... by aurareturn on Thursday June 13, 2024 @06:24AM (#40667886)
Apple Intelligence won't be limited to en_US right? It should be available world wide.
Re:Apple to 'Pay' OpenAI for ChatGPT Through Distribution, N... by d3m0t3p on Thursday June 13, 2024 @07:13AM (#40668149)
Does it need to be sold in the US or simply chaning os settings to use the en_US language is enough to activate this ? I'm in europe but working mostly in english and therfore I set my mac in english. Could I use Apple Intelligence ?
Re:Apple to 'Pay' OpenAI for ChatGPT Through Distribution, N... by tedmiston on Thursday June 13, 2024 @12:18PM (#40671542)
Per Apple's site [1], it's just the language setting:

"* Apple Intelligence will be available in beta on iPhone 15 Pro, iPhone 15 Pro Max, and iPad and Mac with M1 and later, with Siri and device language set to U.S. English, as part of iOS 18, iPadOS 18, and macOS Sequoia this fall."

[1]: https://www.apple.com/apple-intelligence/

Re:Apple to 'Pay' OpenAI for ChatGPT Through Distribution, N... by ben_w on Thursday June 13, 2024 @06:30AM (#40667921)
Eventually, but not initially. I read this thread as if it was about the initial release, not the end-state.

(Given how rapidly AI changes, anything more than a year away isn't easily planned for, even assuming no surprises on the anti-trust front for every Big Tech company nor any surprise new legal obligations for AI).

Re:Apple to 'Pay' OpenAI for ChatGPT Through Distribution, N... by threeseed on Thursday June 13, 2024 @06:21AM (#40667867)
> Also, can OpenAI really handle that much more traffic

Microsoft Azure is handling the traffic.

And Apple would never enter into such a deal without proper capacity planning.

Re:Apple to 'Pay' OpenAI for ChatGPT Through Distribution, N... by benjaminwootton on Thursday June 13, 2024 @07:17AM (#40668190)
There was a press release on the same day talking about how Oracle, Microsoft and OpenAI have a deal for burst capacity. That may be connected.
Re:Apple to 'Pay' OpenAI for ChatGPT Through Distribution, N... by belter on Thursday June 13, 2024 @06:24AM (#40667880)
Satya Nadella subsidizing Apple AI. Did not see that one coming....
Re:Apple to 'Pay' OpenAI for ChatGPT Through Distribution, N... by threeseed on Thursday June 13, 2024 @06:30AM (#40667920)
Microsoft and Apple have had a great relationship for decades.

And Satya would love nothing more than to drive Apple and Google apart.

Re:Apple to 'Pay' OpenAI for ChatGPT Through Distribution, N... by aurareturn on Thursday June 13, 2024 @07:08AM (#40668115)
I'm pretty sure Apple publicly said that they're also considering Google Gemini.

It's possible that Apple sees it as a future app store-like revenue. You can use any AI model you want, and if you want to subscribe to Gemini Pro or ChatGPT Plus, Apple takes 30%.

I was certain that Apple wants to create their own cutting edge LLM to compete with GPT4 or Gemini or Claude or Mixtral. But they've decided to instead, open up all their platforms to 3rd party models.

I suppose Apple may still want to create an Apple Intelligence Pro in the future but their models aren't leading at the moment.

Re:Apple to 'Pay' OpenAI for ChatGPT Through Distribution, N... by threeseed on Thursday June 13, 2024 @08:20AM (#40668749)
Not sure why people keep seeing this situation through the App Store lens.

Apple has had countless partnerships over the years eg. Foursquare, Google, Sensis that don't require a 15/30% commission.

It doesn't even make sense how or why they would implement an IAP flow directly into the OS.

Re:Apple to 'Pay' OpenAI for ChatGPT Through Distribution, N... by hello_kitty2 on Thursday June 13, 2024 @06:32AM (#40667930)
Everything is driven by money. Not relationships or random beliefs.
Re:Apple to 'Pay' OpenAI for ChatGPT Through Distribution, N... by throwaway888abc on Thursday June 13, 2024 @05:56PM (#40675295)
They are getting the data through their wires. That's why Apple make so much effort about anonymization - it's not guarantied by contract. best free RHLF OpenAI can get my 2c.