Yes, OP has troubles, they have spelt them out.
Your "concerns" have zero insight, they are an appeal to heartlessness. Who are you writing them for?
No its really not. People need to eat and not freeze. Period.
This is pretty common IMHO. So should not be regarded as a red flag.
It does indeed. Do you have that deeper understanding? Are you familiar with the job market for devs in Alberta? Have you attempted to understand what reasons there may be for that, or have you just taken a wild assumption (you know what that makes out of you and me)?
> Questionable Survival Tactics: Mentioning social engineering to access hospital facilities and considering theft for food are alarming. While food banks do exist in Canada, their mention of theft instead of seeking such legitimate aid is troubling.
No. If you truly believe any of that sentence please go do some Googling and reflection. There are many reasons why people avoid shelters and foodbanks.
> Story Appealing to a Specific Audience: Their narrative seems particularly designed to resonate with readers of a tech-focused forum like Y Combinator. This targeted appeal could be genuine but also might be a strategy to elicit sympathy and assistance from a specific demographic.
Or it could be that they're part of the same demographic.
> Recurring Pattern of Issues: There's a consistent theme of conflicts and problems in various aspects of their life, including with government systems, psychologists, employers, and personal relationships. The fact that they are the common denominator in these issues is concerning.
I think it's safe to say that most people have (or have had) conflicts with government systems, employers, and personal relationships; and it's quite possible to get a bad psychologist.
I don't know who emilsedgh is but I think it's also safe to say that they read the same post you did. You're not providing any info here, you're just sharing your opinion on why OP should continue being homeless (which essentially boils down to "because he's honest", by the way: he could've easily lied and pretended he fits in perfectly everywhere and just had rotten luck).
some you see them as thugs when it was once a bright individual who had perfect grades; just needed the support to get to where they was destined...instead some parents sell their kids for money instead, than nurturing potential.
reality far from how we was taught, open your eyes; evil is being done and being covered as mental illness
If I heard this while I was interviewing a candidate, I would write a note to myself: "Be prepared for more of this."
> I also brought up the fact I had security concerns in regards to their systems when I went in person but that was brushed aside/ignored
If I heard this while I was interviewing a candidate, I would wonder whether they lacked awareness of the need to follow established processes.
> she kicked me out after my episode of psychosis
So there's at least one occasion when the person had a break from reality, leading to them being kicked out of a house. I know it's important to avoid stigmatizing those with mental illness, but the person has indicated that they had a bad experience with treatment and are not currently in treatment, so it would not be unreasonable to expect that this psychosis could occur again.
> I was able to social engineer myself into being a 'visitor' at a hospital for the past week
Not exactly legal or ethical. Obviously, they're facing dire circumstances, which might mitigate their culpability, but would you want to hire someone who uses social engineering to deceive people?
> I'm going to go and try to find/steal some food now
Again, they're facing dire circumstances, which might mitigate their culpability, but they're also being quite open about being willing to steal, which is not exactly a desirable trait for most employers.
Edit: My last point was not meant to suggest that under these circumstances, stealing a bit of food is reprehensible. Sometimes you've gotta do what you've gotta do. But broadcasting it is the red flag. It indicates a lack of discretion. I'm not trying to be callous here, but GP asked about red flags, so I was trying to describe some.
I mean... ok? So don't try to make their FOSS product your own product?
> If I heard this while I was interviewing a candidate, I would wonder whether they lacked awareness of the need to follow established processes.
Ew. I would wonder why the staff wasn't able to tell him there is a process.
> So there's at least one occasion when the person had a break from reality
"years ago" in an unstable situation.
> Not exactly legal or ethical. Obviously, they're facing dire circumstances, which might mitigate their culpability, but would you want to hire someone who uses social engineering to deceive people?
I'm pretty sure "social engineer" here means something along the lines of "yeah I'm visiting my cousin"
> Again, they're facing dire circumstances, which might mitigate their culpability, but they're also being quite open about being willing to steal, which is not exactly a desirable trait for most employers.
Unless they're working for a grocery store or restaurant I don't think their employer will be worried about them stealing food.
>> I was able to social engineer myself into being a 'visitor' at a hospital for the past week
> Not exactly legal or ethical. Obviously, they're facing dire circumstances, which might mitigate their culpability, but would you want to hire someone who uses social engineering to deceive people?
This is an unfortunate reality in Canada, especially in places where it gets cold enough to freeze to death during the winter (which most of Alberta would qualify for). Homeless shelters are full, the wait lists for social support, mental health support, and addiction support are long*, and hospitals are warm, publicly owned, and honestly so long as you're not making a nuisance of yourself they're probably not the worst place to hang out. There's usually public cafeterias and lots of seating throughout. Sleeping there would probably be a problem.
> bad experience with treatment and are not currently in treatment
This is another one of the oddities of the Canadian healthcare system. There's a few different categories of mental health support:
- Social services is free but often there isn't a whole lot they can help with. Employment Insurance (EI) has a pretty heavy paperwork burden and also requires you to have been employed recently and only lasts for a limited amount of time. Long-term disability has a lot of strings attached. If you do manage to find gainful income they take away your financial support 1:1; a woman I know went blind due to cancer when she was a teenager and was living in an apartment provided by social housing. She started making beaded jewelry and selling it at the farmer's market. Over a period of a year she managed to save up $500 to buy herself an iPad, which apparently has excellent accessibility features for blind users. When her social worker came by and saw it she threatened to deduct $500 off of the next disability cheque.
- There are psychiatrists available, for free, through the public healthcare system. They're by referral only and a referral must come from a GP. 20% of Canadians do not currently have a family doctor (~6M people) so their only access to psychiatric help is to convince a doctor at a walk-in clinic to make a referral. In most cases it's going to be months before you hear back. There are occasionally walk-in clinics that do have on-site psychiatrists but it's exceptionally rare.
- Psychologists and therapists are not covered by the public health system. Some do offer reduced rates for low-income patients but you're generally looking at somewhere in the $80-120/hr range. Like OP mentioned about astrology, there isn't a whole lot of quality control around this... you basically have to go interview them (and likely pay for the privilege) and make your own decision on whether or not you think they'll be someone you want to give more money to.
As an additional wrinkle, while healthcare is nominally free, prescription medication is not (although there was a big announcement around this yesterday, so that may be changing). Even if OP did manage to get an appointment with a psychiatrist and get an assessment and a prescription... how the heck are they going to pay for it? There are generally programs in place to provide medication discounts for low-income people but... again, paperwork burden and long turn-around times.
The brutal question that comes up on a pretty regular basis is: what do we do about people like OP? While we, in theory, have more humanity than just letting them freeze to death in the streets, we also do a piss-poor job at helping them get out of the situation they're in.
* Basically the only way to get seen by someone reasonably quickly is to tell them you're suicidal, but that'll probably result in an involuntary hold for a while.
Much less, this gem, argumentation that you'd expect a 12 year old in debate class to be able to skewer if they wanted a B.
>> I'm going to go and try to find/steal some food now
> Again, they're facing dire circumstances, which might mitigate their culpability, but they're also being quite open about being willing to steal, which is not exactly a desirable trait for most employers.
This person needs social and professional help, and the situation is very unfortunate. But based on the content of the OP if you bring them into your workplace (the assumed context here in this particular thread) without those two things then you should be sure you know what you're doing.
"it's a red flag if an employee ever stole food for a meal / camped at a hospital while homeless" isn't.
Upper-class a-human inanity unrecognizable by 90% of the populace. I wouldn't believe it was a real person making an honest argument if I hadn't self-made my way from inner city Buffalo startup to Boston at Google, and found out how sheltered people can be.
I also feel incredibly heartless for adding my own "be careful" message to this person's eager response to someone's plea for help, but there it is.
I don't want to be overly dramatic, but this has genuinely lowered my view of HN as a whole, and I'll think twice about reading the comments here from now on.
If I were to show this to any well-adjusted person I know, they'd probably think less of me for even being in the same community and profession as the person who wrote that comment.
I agree with you, I wasn't able to provide the full story due to the HN character limit. The contract I signed when I took up work with them explicitly stated my public work will remain mine. If that wasn't in the contract I would have said no. As I put it, it might not be a great look. Thanks for bringing that up
> If I heard this while I was interviewing a candidate, I would wonder whether they lacked awareness of the need to follow established processes.
I agree, there probably is an established process I should have spent time looking into rather than raising the issue directly with the staff who work at the place/with the system itself. Like I said, I was a bit frustrated but it's definitely possible I could have brought that up in a more productive way
> So there's at least one occasion when the person had a break from reality, leading to them being kicked out of a house. I know it's important to avoid stigmatizing those with mental illness, but the person has indicated that they had a bad experience with treatment and are not currently in treatment, so it would not be unreasonable to expect that this psychosis could occur again.
That was my first and so far only episode of psychosis, from my point of view it wasn't so much a bad experience with treatment. But a bad experience by nearly ending up homeless after due to my family kicking me out after I stabilized in the hospital/received/participated in treatment for my first ever episode of psychosis.
> Not exactly legal or ethical. Obviously, they're facing dire circumstances, which might mitigate their culpability, but would you want to hire someone who uses social engineering to deceive people?
I lied about being a visitor compared to the very real alternative of freezing to death, shoot me lol
> Again, they're facing dire circumstances, which might mitigate their culpability, but they're also being quite open about being willing to steal, which is not exactly a desirable trait for most employers.
I somewhat agree, I'm not proud of stealing food and I have already went to a foodbank/received $27 to buy some food but that unfortunately only lasted a few days and I started getting hungry again/haven't been able to find more support for food since. Although maybe I should just try harder. Either way, thanks for bringing up that broadcasting that is a red flag, that is something I should be a bit more wary of, I've made a mental note of that but I doubt I'll need it once I get back on my feet
I would give kudos for honesty
* Completely new ycombinator account created 3 hours ago, no past history.
* Anonymised email service.
* Pseudonym.
None of that is suspicious on its own necessarily but it is part of a pattern.
Everything he says is plausible-ish. Nothing on its own is noteworthy. But there's an undercurrent of "the world is out to get me personally" to it. Everything bad happens to him, he's not responsible for anything that may have put him in his situation.
And that may be true. But the universe doesn't give a shit about anything or anybody. And that permeates down to cellular level. Just whistle right past why his mother won't let him crash. Either his Glosses over why he chose a psychologist who apparently is also an astrologist as well.
And he tries to frame his bad decisions as compassion or desperation on his part. He continued with his astrologist because "he was lonely" and "they recommended he didn't stop seeing them". All that kind of makes me wonder if it was a licensed professional at all. Because if I tell my doctor I want to change, they will refer me to someone else. They have plenty of patients to take care of. I'm not a concern to them beyond the patient-doctor relationship.
And we can back it up all the way to the "poaching". First, he's kind of trying to frame them as being sinister for convincing him to leave his job for them. "No" was an option. And he was hired for his work on an open source project. And they wanted to pay him to work on it and sell a product or service around it. And? Why was that so intolerable to him? Because they didn't make him grand poobah or something? Because they had the means to do so when he doesn't? So he left. And apparently he left his previous job in such a way they wouldn't have him back.
He also exaggerates his own skills. Like the claim he "social engineered" his way into being a visitor at a hospital. Yeah. That's just straight up lying. You go sit in a visitor's area and say you're visiting. It's not difficult or challenging. Most people don't do it because there's no need to.
And I'm sure he has PTSD and issues stemming from that because it's written all over his post. This dude needs to make life traumatic because that's the only thing he knows. It's the only thing he's comfortable with. Everything has to be a confrontation, a challenge, adversarial, because for the first 8 years of his life, that was his life. He thinks that's normal.
So yes, you could take him in. Give him a roof, three hots, and a cot. And yeah, for the first few weeks, it'll seem good. He'll be thankful. Then there will be an issue. He'll do something or claim you did something. It'll be small. But it will build and build and build until every day is just a fucking struggle with him. Then you'll kick him out and he'll add you to his story of woe. About how you kicked him out. And he might make sad, puppy dog eyes and hang his head about how it was a psychotic episode and not really his fault. And he doesn't really blame you for what happened. But good lord, is it fucking tiring when every story someone tells wants to compete with yet another Shakespearian tragedy.
So yeah, the longer his tale unfolded, the warier I became.
> there's an undercurrent of "the world is out to get me personally" to it. Everything bad happens to him, he's not responsible for anything that may have put him in his situation.
I'm 100% responsible for choosing to leave a good company to pick up a contract with a company working on something similiar to my FOSS project, a contract that explicitly stated any and all public work I have will remain mine, not to mention the fact my project is AGPL licensed.
> Glosses over why he chose a psychologist who apparently is also an astrologist as well.
I didn't choose my psychologist, they came highly recommended to me by a psychitriast I was seeing who I've had to since stop seeing due to the fact his case load was too much and he moved to a different province. I didn't actually know she was an astrologist until she brought that up, that's when I started paying attention/learning about red flags to watch out for.
> "No" was an option. And he was hired for his work on an open source project. And they wanted to pay him to work on it and sell a product or service around it. And? Why was that so intolerable to him?
I find it amusing you bring up "framing", that's what you are doing. I wasn't hired to work on my open source project, the contract I signed explicitly stated my public work will remain mine, although the reality turned out different :)
> And apparently he left his previous job in such a way they wouldn't have him back.
I did yes, I wasn't working with them for very long and they were quite pissed I left so soon. I'll own that mistake
> exaggerates his own skills. Like the claim he "social engineered" his way into being a visitor at a hospital. Yeah. That's just straight up lying. You go sit in a visitor's area and say you're visiting. It's not difficult or challenging. Most people don't do it because there's no need to.
https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/social%20engineer...
> management of human beings in accordance with their place and function in society : applied social science
You're correct, it's cold and I don't want to freeze so I lied and claimed to be a visitor. Perhaps I misunderstand this definition found at this dictionary I linked, would you be so kind as to explain it like I'm 5?
> This dude needs to make life traumatic because that's the only thing he knows. It's the only thing he's comfortable with. Everything has to be a confrontation, a challenge, adversarial, because for the first 8 years of his life, that was his life. He thinks that's normal.
I would much rather life not be traumatic, I try my best to be kind to people but regardless I make mistakes sometimes, like all humans do. I'm curious as to what I said that indicates my circumstances are me trying to make my life more traumatic than it already is. Please do explain, I'd love to learn about/hear more about that perspective :)
> You could take him in. Give him a roof, three hots, and a cot. And yeah, for the first few weeks
That's not what I'm requesting, could you please quote what I said that indicates that? Perhaps I need to work on my communication more :) I kind of was more or less just looking for people I could talk to who would be kind/understanding. Someone reached out saying they would be willing to pay for a hotel for me for a couple nights but I replied that I wouldn't really feel comfortable with that coming from a stranger but also that I wouldn't say no and I'd do my best to pay them back once I'm back on my feet
I really do hope you never experience hardship in life, take care of yourself :)
He claims he's not trying to absolve himself of responsibility, but there are places where he does just that.
He didn't choose his psychologist. Apparently he was forced to see them. Against his will. He had no choice. And now, he left as soon as he learned they were an astrologist rather than giving them a chance.
He wants to say he doesn't exaggerate and plays this weird definition game to try and play off the fact that he was trying to make "lying to sleep in a hospital visitor's wing" sound more sophisticated than it was. He's not gaining access to anything anyone really cares about. He's loitering. People don't care that much that someone's loitering in the visitor's wing. Eventually, someone notices he's been "visiting" for a bit too long and tells him to shuffle on.
And look, I propose a hypothetical. That you could bend over backwards for this guy and it would eventually turn sour. And he took it as if I were seriously suggesting you do that and believe that's what he was asking for. Because that's the reading that allows him to make this a confrontation.
I sincerely believe he does not want his life to be traumatic, but he's developed certain patterns in his actions and speech that engenders negative responses.
I hope he finds the therapy he needs to work past his trauma so he can stop sabotaging himself.
He also believes that since I don't swallow his shit whole, I've never experienced hardship myself. Which is terribly condescending. Maybe others are capable of introspection and are able to overcome their situation.
Where did I claim I was "forced" to see them? I was seeking help/support with my mental health so I asked a psychiatrist I trusted for advice. What would you recommend doing for someone in a position like mine? You throw a whole lot of accusations around but seem to offer very little practical advice lol
> left as soon as he learned they were an astrologist rather than giving them a chance.
I also don't think I claimed this but feel free to quote where I perhaps miscommunicated this. I actually kept seeing them probably far longer than I should have because I grew attached to them/learned to trust them depsite them very likely not being a great choice for me and for improving my mental health.
> not gaining access to anything anyone really cares about
No shit sherlock, but if you don't lie about being a visitor you'll get kicked out right away
This clearly isn't going to be a productive conversation and you've made it obvious you have no knowledge or interest in offering any sort of practical advice for someone experiencing hardship, however you're very good at being demeaning, insulting, and rude so I guess this will be my last reply to you. Good luck with your life, and once again, I really do hope you don't experience much hardship in life and if you do, hopefully someone offers you some practical advice/kindness rather than being shitty and demeaning towards you
#1 reason for becoming homeless is not asking for help when you need to.
I can see how this conclusion would be appealing from that perspective but I’d encourage anyone with this line of thinking, to think twice before posting something to cause doubt and potentially causing someone else to receive less help/attention that they would have otherwise received.
Even if you think it’s plausible for someone to lie about something like a few years of open source contribution (which is very easy to verify for anyone who reaches out for them to help) please contemplate about the possibility of harm that this kind of comment might cause (a fellow human being suffering longer) vs the help you think you are providing by just casting doubt and uncertainty (potentially preventing someone more fortunate to send some money to someone else that didn’t actually need it?! Or they might be offered a job they might not have been offered otherwise?!).
O.P. I’m really sorry for what you’re going through, and I admire your courage and honesty. I hope life becomes more stable very soon!