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Re:SSDs Have Become Fast, Except in the Cloud by dekhn on Tuesday February 20, 2024 @04:39PM (#39447308)
it sounds like you're trying to say "PCI switch" without saying "PCI switch" (I worked at Google for over a decade, including hardware division).
Re:SSDs Have Become Fast, Except in the Cloud by pclmulqdq on Tuesday February 20, 2024 @09:42PM (#39449574)
That is what I am trying to say without actually giving it out. PCIe switches are very much not transparent devices. Apparently AWS has not published anything about this, and doesn't have Nitro moderating access to "local" SSD, though - that I did get confused with EBS.
Re:SSDs Have Become Fast, Except in the Cloud by pzb on Tuesday February 20, 2024 @11:40PM (#39450226)
AWS has stated that there is a "Nitro Card for Instance Storage"[0][1] which is a NVMe PCIe controller that implements transparent encryption[2].

I don't have access to an EC2 instance to check, but you should be able to see the PCIe topology to determine how many physical cards are likely in i4i and im4gn and their PCIe connections. i4i claims to have 8 x 3,750 AWS Nitro SSD, but it isn't clear how many PCIe lanes are used.

Also, AWS claims "Traditionally, SSDs maximize the peak read and write I/O performance. AWS Nitro SSDs are architected to minimize latency and latency variability of I/O intensive workloads [...] which continuously read and write from the SSDs in a sustained manner, for fast and more predictable performance. AWS Nitro SSDs deliver up to 60% lower storage I/O latency and up to 75% reduced storage I/O latency variability [...]"

This could explain the findings in the article - they only meared peak r/w, not predictability.

[0] https://perspectives.mvdirona.com/2019/02/aws-nitro-system/ [1] https://aws.amazon.com/ec2/nitro/ [2] https://d1.awsstatic.com/events/reinvent/2019/REPEAT_2_Power...

Re:SSDs Have Become Fast, Except in the Cloud by rowanG077 on Wednesday February 21, 2024 @02:00AM (#39450902)
Why are you acting as if PCIe switches are some secret technology? It was extremely grating for me to read your comments.
Re:SSDs Have Become Fast, Except in the Cloud by stingraycharles on Wednesday February 21, 2024 @08:34AM (#39453547)
Because the parent works/worked for Google, so obviously it must be super secret sauce that nobody has heard of. /s

Next up they’re going explain to us that iSCSI wants us to think it’s SCSI but it’s actually not!

Re:SSDs Have Become Fast, Except in the Cloud by the-rc on Wednesday February 21, 2024 @08:51AM (#39453766)
Although it used them for years, the first mention by Google of PCIe switches was probably in the 2022 Aquila paper, which doesn't really talk about storage anyway...
Re:SSDs Have Become Fast, Except in the Cloud by rowanG077 on Wednesday February 21, 2024 @01:00PM (#39457173)
I don't understand why you would expect Google to state that. They have been standard technology for almost 2 decades. You don't see google claiming they use jtag or using SPI flash or whatever. It's just not special.
Re:SSDs Have Become Fast, Except in the Cloud by the-rc on Wednesday February 21, 2024 @10:36PM (#39462921)
Google didn't invent the Clos network, either, but it took years before they started talking about its adoption and with what kind of proprietary twists. Same with power supplies. You're right, a PCIe switch is not special, unless maybe it's integrated in some unconventional way. It's in Google's DNA to be cagey by default on a lot of details, to avoid giving ideas to the competition. Or misleading others down rabbit holes, like with shipping container datacenters.
Re:SSDs Have Become Fast, Except in the Cloud by sitkack on Thursday February 22, 2024 @07:29AM (#39466137)
No, it dismisses technology until it does a 180 and then pretends it innovated in ways everyone is too stupid to understand. Google exceptionalism 101.
Re:SSDs Have Become Fast, Except in the Cloud by dekhn on Wednesday February 21, 2024 @01:39PM (#39457669)
Like many other people in this thread, I think we disagree that a PCI switch means that an SSD "is connected over a network" to the host bus.

Now if you can show me two or more hosts connected to a box of SSDs through a PCI switch (and some sort of cool tech for coordinating between the hosts), that's interesting.