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Re:Ask HN: Who else is working on nothing? by brabel on Saturday January 13, 2024 @03:09PM (#38984025)
> I started my career during the dot com boom, and there was so much optimism about the beneficial societal changes that tech and the Internet would bring. I don't feel like all tech is "evil" these days...

Wow that's so true... we totally didn't see the social media dystopia we're living in today coming. We imagined a world where everyone has all the world knowledge available at their fingertips would be wonderful. How wrong were we.

Re:Ask HN: Who else is working on nothing? by hunter2_ on Saturday January 13, 2024 @04:02PM (#38984527)
On average, yes it's easy to get stuck in a rut with low quality content, toxic social media, attention-stealing recommendations, etc. but with just a reasonable amount of effort it can be avoided in favor of the good stuff. Just like a traveler can get stuck at tourist traps or with just a few more moments of planning find a local treasure; and how if you're at a buffet you could get locked into the mac & cheese or go find the hibachi station in the back. It would be nice if getting lost wasn't a thing, but it's not terribly onerous to navigate the scenic route.
Re:Ask HN: Who else is working on nothing? by j4yav on Saturday January 13, 2024 @04:09PM (#38984589)
But we are surrounded by people not doing that, and not even through any fault of their own for the most part. They are wired into an endless machine that trades dopamine hits for their money. Children are wired in before they even have a chance to resist.
Re:Ask HN: Who else is working on nothing? by mattgreenrocks on Saturday January 13, 2024 @05:14PM (#38985169)
The Extremely Online crowd’s influence is waning.

Twitter is widely mocked as a cesspool of conversation. Facebook is seen as antiquated. Instagram and TikTok are the current darlings but they seem to have less of an iron grip than the OG social networks.

The future is probably not another winner-take-all network. We’ve tried enough of those. The future is probably smaller networks where users self-select into them based on affiliations, much like web forums.

Re:Ask HN: Who else is working on nothing? by t0bia_s on Sunday January 14, 2024 @01:44AM (#38988105)
You mean Discord (interest, hobbies) and family chat channels on various platforms?
Re:Ask HN: Who else is working on nothing? by genevra on Sunday January 14, 2024 @06:06AM (#38989399)
Weird, I've seen social media and "online communities" move into the publicly accepted sphere more and more. 10 years ago you'd be looked at funny by certain people if you said you had a social media or reddit account, and nowadays it's just sorta expected
Re:Ask HN: Who else is working on nothing? by webworker on Sunday January 14, 2024 @07:40PM (#38996028)
This is just a side note, but my Instagram feed has become basically entirely irrelevant. It's just reel after reel from people promoting themselves or some product. The network feels increasingly like a rapid-paced HSN/home shopping network or similar.

Do I look at it daily? Yes, I do. But I'd say that 95% of the content I see on it is junk, very few of my peers are posting their lives on there.

As for blue-line Facebook, it's so slow it's borderline unusable. I'm not sure what happened (ReactJS maybe?), but the performance is a fraction of what it was ten years ago.

> The future is probably smaller networks where users self-select into them based on affiliations, much like web forums.

Yeah it's like everyone got drunk on connection and is slowly rediscovering peace in disconnecting. I'd wager you're right about this.

Re:Ask HN: Who else is working on nothing? by mattgreenrocks on Monday January 15, 2024 @03:18PM (#39005543)
Yep. My IG feed is very quiet after I muted all the self-promoters and overly-prolific posters. Plus, I only follow people I know IRL, so I hit the "you're caught up" marker within 20s or so easily. The result is it is very rare to load up IG and find something of interest. I can still stay connected, but it doesn't grab me. I feel like the reel section just doesn't work for me, either.

> very few of my peers are posting their lives on there

Yes, this is not a great sign for IG. It is still relevant in that people click the icon everyday, but it seems to be slipping.

Re:Ask HN: Who else is working on nothing? by ryandrake on Saturday January 13, 2024 @05:20PM (#38985210)
I used to feel like I wanted to "Save Them From Themselves" but I no longer care. As long as I and my family are not zombies, I could care less that the rest of these people we're surrounded by are lobotomizing themselves. As long as they aren't in my way they can do what they want. They'll be voluntarily stepping into their own Matrix Pods in 20 years and I won't be.
Re:Ask HN: Who else is working on nothing? by hn_throwaway_99 on Saturday January 13, 2024 @07:48PM (#38986304)
I used to feel the way that you do, but in a social democracy "I don't care what those idiot zombies do" has it's limits, because everyone gets an equal vote.

Also, you say that "As long as I and my family are not zombies", but every single one of my friends and family with kids age 10 and up are genuinely pretty terrified about the potential impact of social media on their kids: "I feel so lucky I didn't have to deal with this when I was growing up" is a common refrain I hear. And yes, all these parents try to teach their kids about the pitfalls of social media, but they know they can't just can it, so it's a huge, largely negative influence that they feel limited power to fight against.

Re:Ask HN: Who else is working on nothing? by amelius on Saturday January 13, 2024 @03:37PM (#38984289)
In the early 90s the internet was great. The problems started with companies and their inherent greed.
Re:Ask HN: Who else is working on nothing? by castalian on Saturday January 13, 2024 @04:11PM (#38984614)
No, it was the people. Early internet users demographics was a result of extreme selection. Companies did exist back then.
Re:Ask HN: Who else is working on nothing? by amelius on Saturday January 13, 2024 @04:17PM (#38984665)
Companies existed of course, but they provided the building blocks of the internet and were not directly concerned with the processing of our data.
Re:Ask HN: Who else is working on nothing? by bakugo on Saturday January 13, 2024 @04:46PM (#38984913)
This is true. The big turning point was the release of the iPhone, a device that allowed people who didn't know what a computer was to access the internet.
Re:Ask HN: Who else is working on nothing? by kian on Saturday January 13, 2024 @06:46PM (#38985923)
I'd also call out Eternal September in 1993, when AOL made it easy for anyone with a computer to connect online. This permanently changed the composition of the internet, and paved the way for the social networks that would later come to dominance after the iPhone was released.
Re:Ask HN: Who else is working on nothing? by ponector on Sunday January 14, 2024 @12:10PM (#38992171)
Why iphone? We had internet on mobile phones before that point.

But I agree with idea that internet became dumber with more people in.

Re:Ask HN: Who else is working on nothing? by hn_throwaway_99 on Sunday January 14, 2024 @08:17PM (#38996278)
> Why iphone? We had internet on mobile phones before that point.

Certainly not in any way that mattered, and I say this as someone who spent the middle part of my career specifically on mobile.

I mean, sure, there was stuff like WAP, and some other niche phones that could (very, very clunkily) display full HTML. But the launch of the iPhone is what first brought the mobile Internet to the masses (and pretty much all smartphones after the iPhone aped the basic design), and most importantly, was the beginning of the change where websites started even giving a shit about mobile clients ("Mobile first" design and all that).

Re:Ask HN: Who else is working on nothing? by mecha_ghidorah on Monday January 15, 2024 @12:08AM (#38997644)
I think mostly just the iPhone exploded it, and also made a lot of things much more low effort. Like take for example people constantly posting photos of themselves and food and what have you on social media - pre iPhone high quality photos required a separate camera and a computer in order to upload onto social media. Post iPhone you could do it all from one device.
Re:Ask HN: Who else is working on nothing? by gopher_space on Saturday January 13, 2024 @05:28PM (#38985283)
Barriers to entry that revolve around level of interest are ok.
Re:Ask HN: Who else is working on nothing? by mandeepj on Saturday January 13, 2024 @04:02PM (#38984535)
> How wrong were we

Nowhere! Social media brought out the true character of people; most (many?) of us are negative species, mix that along with bad people.

Re:Ask HN: Who else is working on nothing? by doctorwho42 on Saturday January 13, 2024 @04:37PM (#38984841)
Ehh this type of thinking is reductive.

The primary issues are a combination of nature vs nurture. The age of argument, the solution has always been some combination of both.

But when you look at our western society over the past 60 years or so, you see that -fundamentally- the nurture part of the equation is being heavily influenced by capitalistic forces. For example, news used to be once a day, then 3 times a day, now 24/7/365. There isn't more news now than 100 years ago, so how do you feel all that time and how do you keep someone engaged? (If you have been paying attention, you know the answer is selling fear, sex, violence, and other negative emotions are traits of the human species.)

But really, the easiest way to counter this toxic mindset was said best by mister Rodgers: just look for the helpers. Look for the guys running into the fray when everyone else runs away... Those people are just as human as you or me... They are the true character of the human species. For we are a communal species that depends on one another, we always have, we aren't a bad species... We are just letting our man made systems bring out the worst.

Re:Ask HN: Who else is working on nothing? by johnnyanmac on Sunday January 14, 2024 @10:18AM (#38991149)
>Look for the guys running into the fray when everyone else runs away... Those people are just as human as you or me... They are the true character of the human species.

If we have to look to find them, are they really the "true" character? I'm sure if we look hard enough we could find a polite polar bear, but is that a "true" polar bear?

Re:Ask HN: Who else is working on nothing? by vwcx on Sunday January 14, 2024 @12:40PM (#38992434)
main characters =/= dominant characters =/= true characters
Re:Ask HN: Who else is working on nothing? by mecha_ghidorah on Monday January 15, 2024 @12:11AM (#38997652)
> There isn't more news now than 100 years ago, so how do you feel all that time and how do you keep someone engaged?

So, I agree with your point, and I also agree that there isn't enough news to fill 24/7 coverage... but there is definitely more news, or at least more news that may be of interest to any given audience, than 100 years ago because we live in a more globally connected society where issues in another country can absolutely have direct impact on us because manufacturing/materials sourcing became something that now happens on a more global scale.

Re:Ask HN: Who else is working on nothing? by smugglerFlynn on Sunday January 14, 2024 @11:40AM (#38991915)
I think what we have really underestimated is the amount of people who would get hooked on instant gratification more than this available knowledge (which, turns out, I am also guilty of).

Then came for-profits that agressively monetised every single bad habit one might imagine online and got us where we are today. Knowledge is still at the fingertips, but so many of us are now short-attention-span information-holics and instant gratification addicts.

We imagined brave new world, but became an equivalent of chain smoking addicts trying to break out of their habit in a world where everyone else also smokes.