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Re:Before Altman’s ouster, OpenAI’s board was divided and fe... by paulddraper on Tuesday November 21, 2023 @08:31PM (#38373403)
No, Sam wanted to be the first recipient of Helen's expression.

So -- if appropriate -- he could make changes.

Or he could not change, and she publishes anyway.

Re:Before Altman’s ouster, OpenAI’s board was divided and fe... by mcny on Tuesday November 21, 2023 @08:48PM (#38373565)
>> Sam wanted to restrict Helen's free expression.

> No, Sam wanted to be the first recipient of Helen's expression.

If I get copy approval to what you write, that is by definition a restriction to your freedom of expression. How is this up for debate?

Re:Before Altman’s ouster, OpenAI’s board was divided and fe... by jacquesm on Tuesday November 21, 2023 @09:34PM (#38373937)
You don't normally perform you role as a board member through publications in a public forum. You do it by exercising pressure internally to get the effect you desire so you can continue to do so in the future. Going public is usually a one-shot affair.
Re:Before Altman’s ouster, OpenAI’s board was divided and fe... by comp_throw7 on Tuesday November 21, 2023 @09:52PM (#38374108)
Being a co-author of that publication was not her performing her role as an OpenAI board member, it was her day job.
Re:Before Altman’s ouster, OpenAI’s board was divided and fe... by jacquesm on Tuesday November 21, 2023 @09:54PM (#38374134)
Conflicts of interest suck. Experienced board members avoid them or deal with them. They don't allow their conflicts of interest to spiral out of control to the point that they destroy the thing they're supposed to govern.
Re:Before Altman’s ouster, OpenAI’s board was divided and fe... by comp_throw7 on Tuesday November 21, 2023 @10:06PM (#38374237)
> Conflicts of interest suck. Experienced board members avoid them or deal with them.

Agreed. It seems remarkable that she dealt with her conflict of interest so thoroughly that she published an article that was mildly critical of the organization. I do not think her duty was to let Sam Altman seize power by firing her from the board on a flimsy pretext, though.

Re:Before Altman’s ouster, OpenAI’s board was divided and fe... by jacquesm on Tuesday November 21, 2023 @10:11PM (#38374273)
She went a bit further than that.
Re:Before Altman’s ouster, OpenAI’s board was divided and fe... by 0xDEAFBEAD on Tuesday November 21, 2023 @10:32PM (#38374434)
Did Helen's publication conflict with the charter though?

I'd say the OpenAI employees are the ones with the conflict of interest, since they stand to get rich if the company does well, independent of whether the charter is being upheld.

Re:Before Altman’s ouster, OpenAI’s board was divided and fe... by jacquesm on Tuesday November 21, 2023 @10:43PM (#38374505)
No, it did not conflict. But that doesn't mean you first try to get things fixed rather than to publish.

> I'd say the OpenAI employees are the ones with the conflict of interest, since they stand to get rich if the company does well, independent of whether the charter is being upheld.

Those pesky employees again. Too bad we still need them. But after AGI is a fact we don't and then it'll be a brave new world.

Re:Before Altman’s ouster, OpenAI’s board was divided and fe... by BryantD on Tuesday November 21, 2023 @11:59PM (#38374908)
It’s interesting that people are making the assumption Toner didn’t raise these concerns internally as well.
Re:Before Altman’s ouster, OpenAI’s board was divided and fe... by obmelvin on Tuesday November 21, 2023 @08:51PM (#38373596)
My interpretation of that was that Sam felt Helen's duty as a board member is to come to the company with her complaints, and work to improve the safety measures.
Re:Before Altman’s ouster, OpenAI’s board was divided and fe... by for1nner on Tuesday November 21, 2023 @08:40PM (#38373476)
> So -- if appropriate -- he could make changes.

Where are you drawing this conclusion from? Nothing in the text suggests that was his intent - certainly his actions thereafter suggest that he was in fact more concerned with the potential harm to the for-profit company.

Re:Before Altman’s ouster, OpenAI’s board was divided and fe... by z7 on Tuesday November 21, 2023 @09:26PM (#38373865)
The journalist failed to make that point really clear. He "reprimanded" her "and" said "it was dangerous to the company". What exactly did he "reprimand" her for? The "and" seems to imply two separate points of criticism.

>In the email, Mr. Altman said that he had reprimanded Ms. Toner for the paper and that it was dangerous to the company, particularly at a time, he added, when the Federal Trade Commission was investigating OpenAI over the data used to build its technology.

Re:Before Altman’s ouster, OpenAI’s board was divided and fe... by paulddraper on Tuesday November 21, 2023 @08:43PM (#38373501)
The normal operation of every human relationship.
Re:Before Altman’s ouster, OpenAI’s board was divided and fe... by cycomanic on Tuesday November 21, 2023 @10:37PM (#38374457)
Let's recall the CEO is employed by the board, not the other way around.
Re:Before Altman’s ouster, OpenAI’s board was divided and fe... by FireBeyond on Tuesday November 21, 2023 @09:55PM (#38374139)
Is Sam a member of her faculty? Or an advisor?

Otherwise I'm not sure what changes would be "appropriate" for him to direct.