Not that its representative necessarily but have you been screened for AD(H)D, the leg and foot tapping/shaking was always a big thing for me. And its not parkinsons lol, otherwise I've had it my whole life ;)

I haven't, but who knows, we're all a bit neurodivergent here. I can get completely dispersed but also deeply focused to the point of jumping on my seat whenever the phone or door rings.

None of that is dispositive on the ADHD side lol

Tapping or that thing where you keep the ball of the foot on the floor and then shake the leg like trying to double-bass hit a-la John Bonham? That's the one I do. Annoys the heck out of everyone around cause it shakes things. So they say Stop! Then get frustrated with my too-loud typing or humming or... whatever, gotta let that excess energy out somehow.

Interrupting my focus state with "why are you doing that?" - doing what?

That's the perfect description :) And yes, it does annoy everyone. I had a stranger ask me to stop in a movie theater once, the seats were connected and it would shake the whole line. My wife just lays her hand on my leg and not a word needs to be sponken.

As I'm getting older, the tip of the foot can start to get a little numb if I'm too excited.

This was me! Complete with annoyning everybody and my wife putting her hand on my leg to make me notice I'm doing it.

I did eventually "break the habit"[1] by paying undue attention to my leg for years and intentionally stopping when it started. What I don't know is if it would have gone away on its own, or if my effort fixed things.

[1] It comes back when I'm unusually tired or stressed, though.

Andrew Huberman notes this is an effective weight loss technique due to calories spend bouncing one's heel/tapping due. Apparently, the calf muscle is unique in that the repetitive action translates into calories burnt.

Well, that's the excuse I was wating for. “I'm exercising!”

> I’ve been tapping my foot ferociously since I was a kid and the most I’ve been “on” is caffeine. Lots of it, though

So you're kind of proving the parent poster's point, no?

Or are you suggesting caffeine is not stimulant or a psychoactive drug?

Not a strong one and I do it when “sober” too. Also when sleepy.

It's strong enough to measurably increase your metabolic rest rate and consequent calorie consumption even without obsessive foot tapping.

Also, the foot tapping behavior can be related to caffeine consumption even if you also do it when not taking caffeine. Some people (like me) metabolize caffeine a lot slower than average, so its effects last a lot longer (twice longer or so, I think). Also, caffeine notably causes sleep disruption. And caffeine withdrawal can also cause irritability.

Caffeine can also increase anxiety or anxiety-related behaviors, and even if anxiety or these behaviors are not exclusively experienced while taking caffeine, it can still increase the likelihood and magnitude of its effects. These behaviors can also persist in the absence of substance intake for a variety of (psychological) reasons.

It is psychoactive, but not remotely as strong as amphetamine. I don’t think that’s controversial.

Well, then let me challenge your "not remotely as strong" claims.

A typical cup of coffee contains about the same proportion of caffeine compared to a lethal caffeine dose than the proportion of one Aderall dosage compared to a lethal amphetamine dose.

How about that?

I thought we were discussing psychoactive effects, not lethality.

Isn't lethality the strongest psychoactive effect?

It's a decent measure for how much a certain amount of a drug is likely to cause immediate important effects in the body.

It’s not. There’s no known lethal dose for LSD, for instance. And it takes only a few grams to have incredibly potent psychoactive effect

The estimated average lethal dose for LSD in humans is only 100 mg, based on rodent studies. Far less than caffeine and even amphetamines.

LSD does cause significant psychoactive effects with one thousandth of that amount, which suggests that for a typical isolated dose, LSD is safer than caffeine and amphetamines. Not to mention that LSD is not as addictive.

But I don't think that invalidates my underlying point regarding caffeine, even if the lethal dose is not a perfect measure.

There’s no correlation between lethality and psychoactive strength and you’re trying to make a point based on it.

> There’s no correlation between lethality and psychoactive strength and you’re trying to make a point based on it.

Of course there is. I think you just proved you don't understand what a correlation is...

Here’s Wikipedia article for one of the most powerful psychoactive substances known to man:

“Overdose: There have been no documented fatal human overdoses from LSD”

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/LSD

Toxicity and psychoactivity are completely independent from one another. If you can’t understand that there’s not much else I can say to you.

Could you please stop posting in the flamewar style and/or otherwise breaking the site guidelines? You've unfortunately been doing it repeatedly. It's not what this site is for, and destroys what it is for.

If you wouldn't mind reviewing https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html and taking the intended spirit of the site more to heart, we'd be grateful.