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Re:The OpenTF Manifesto by tedivm on Tuesday August 15, 2023 @10:32AM (#37134474)
These people have seriously contributed back to the Terraform community. Terraform doesn't have a test suite- Grunt made Terratest, as well as many other tools. These people have seriously contributed back to the ecosystem, in many ways beyond what Hashicorp has done.

Beyond that, I know some of these companies tried to be contributors to Terraform itself but were ghosted by Hashicorp.

At the same time there's only a handful of regular contributors to Terraform[1]. It would not be hard for these companies to provide more resources to Terraform than Hashicorp is.

https://github.com/hashicorp/terraform/pulse/monthly

Re:The OpenTF Manifesto by rjbwork on Tuesday August 15, 2023 @11:32AM (#37135215)
Probably not difficult for these competitor organizations to fund an OpenTF team to hire some of these people away from HashiCorp and continue it on as FOSS either. I can't imagine Liam turning down .5M/year to do so.
Re:The OpenTF Manifesto by fishnchips on Tuesday August 15, 2023 @11:58AM (#37135556)
Marcin here, co-founder at Spacelift. We are open to fund 5 FTEs, feel free to reach out to us via the pledge page if you're interested in OpenTF becoming your full-time job.
Re:The OpenTF Manifesto by tedivm on Tuesday August 15, 2023 @12:15PM (#37135774)
This is the first time I've been disappointed that I really like my current job, as that sounds like it would be pretty awesome.
Re:The OpenTF Manifesto by lijok on Tuesday August 15, 2023 @12:13PM (#37135741)
Gruntwork is the only one of these companies that I genuinely cannot understand Hashicorp having any beef with.
Re:The OpenTF Manifesto by jen20 on Tuesday August 15, 2023 @12:20PM (#37135829)
> Terraform doesn't have a test suite

Patently false. Terraform has had an excellent test suite since 2014.

Re:The OpenTF Manifesto by tedivm on Tuesday August 15, 2023 @12:27PM (#37135934)
Sorry, this may be a miscommunication. Terraform itself has a test suite, yeah, but it doesn't have a testing framework that users of the language can use to test their own code.

To make a python metaphor, if cpython had a testing suite but pytest didn't exist then people wouldn't be able to test their own python code. That's kind of the situation with Terraform right now- you can't test your code using just the Terraform tools, you have to rely on Terratest which was written by Gruntwork. Hashicorp has spent years relying on the open source community to fill those gaps, which Gruntwork has done very nicely.

Hashicorp even recommends Terratest for testing: https://www.hashicorp.com/blog/testing-hashicorp-terraform

Re:The OpenTF Manifesto by pseg134 on Tuesday August 15, 2023 @01:03PM (#37136392)
It isn’t a miscommunication, jen20 is astroturfing for hashicorp. Look at all of their recent posts.
Re:The OpenTF Manifesto by jen20 on Tuesday August 15, 2023 @01:35PM (#37136874)
"Astroturfing"... lol OK. I don't think I've ever made it a secret that I worked for HashiCorp in the early days (leaving in 2017), and have been critical to the point of being banned by the CEO from speaking at HashiConf.

Saying "Terraform doesn't have a test suite" is not miscommunication, it is misinformation, plain and simple - the same as most of the other things I have been correcting this week (not least from the same poster in this thread - someone who's clearly has an axe to grind).

Re:The OpenTF Manifesto by candiddevmike on Tuesday August 15, 2023 @03:48PM (#37138467)
You and the OP are referring to different things. Terraform the codebase has a test suite. Terraform the app does not have a test suite/runner as in a way to run tests against your Terraform files.
Re:The OpenTF Manifesto by jen20 on Tuesday August 15, 2023 @04:09PM (#37138730)
It doesn’t have a testing tool built in. No one legitimately understands the phrase “terraform doesn’t have a test suite” to mean anything except “there are no tests”. A runner and a suite are quite different.
Re:The OpenTF Manifesto by tedivm on Tuesday August 15, 2023 @07:08PM (#37140487)
I can understand the miscommunication in the first post, but I clarified in a direct comment to you what I meant. I was even comparing it to Terratest, which is not used for testing terraform core. At this point you're just being belligerent for the sake of being belligerent.
Re:The OpenTF Manifesto by jen20 on Tuesday August 15, 2023 @07:38PM (#37140824)
I'm not arguing with you, your clarifying comment was fine. I'm arguing with the person who replied to you.
Re:The OpenTF Manifesto by empressplay on Tuesday August 15, 2023 @02:29PM (#37137519)
Re:The OpenTF Manifesto by candiddevmike on Tuesday August 15, 2023 @02:57PM (#37137814)
No, that's a rough guesstimate from Terrafrom on what actions it will be doing. Terratest allows you to write actual tests and mocks.
Re:The OpenTF Manifesto by jen20 on Wednesday August 16, 2023 @10:27AM (#37147569)
This one needs some clarification.

It’s actually not a guesstimate about what actions will be taken, it’s a guesstimate of the state that will result from those actions without any reference to ordering or “actions” as a cloud API would understand them - the plan is purely in terms of CRUD on Terraform provider resources and provisioners.

This may seem like a nit, but it fundamentally changes what Terraform is capable of doing in a single pass without external coordination.

Re:The OpenTF Manifesto by DrRobinson on Tuesday August 15, 2023 @04:07PM (#37138707)
> Terraform doesn't have a test suite- Grunt made Terratest

They have experimental support: https://developer.hashicorp.com/terraform/language/modules/t...