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Re:Ode to the M1 by presentation on Sunday August 13, 2023 @02:32AM (#37107228)
Keep hoping, because it won’t happen. Practically no consumers care except for other software engineers complaining loudly on HN, and meanwhile companies save millions by not handcrafting their CRUD apps in assembly.
Re:Ode to the M1 by jrockway on Sunday August 13, 2023 @02:46AM (#37107289)
The problem is having to target 5 operating systems. Extremely complicated web app runs on Linux, Windows, Mac, Android, and iOS. Carefully-crafted Native UI widgets only target one platform at a time.

If you want to get rid of Electron, you personally have to volunteer to be responsible for 5x the work of anyone else, and accept bootcamp-graduate pay. Do you see why it's not happening?

Re:Ode to the M1 by raverbashing on Sunday August 13, 2023 @03:33AM (#37107540)
Exactly this.

And HTML/CSS may have its quirks but I'll take it every day over fumbling with GTK or whatever

Re:Ode to the M1 by satvikpendem on Sunday August 13, 2023 @04:57AM (#37107997)
I just use Flutter instead, works great for all 5 OS.
Re:Ode to the M1 by bombcar on Sunday August 13, 2023 @08:14AM (#37109203)
Arguably the success of MacOS has caused the expansion of Electron, because developers are using macs and want to use macs even when programming tools for windows.
Re:Ode to the M1 by caycep on Monday August 14, 2023 @10:55AM (#37121755)
Some (maybe Apple) ought to make a Swift -> Windows/Linux cross compiler...
Re:Ode to the M1 by LtWorf on Sunday August 13, 2023 @04:09AM (#37107725)
Consumers care but have no choice.

Like consumers that want to buy a phone that fit in the hand… there is none at a reasonable price.

Re:Ode to the M1 by wiseowise on Sunday August 13, 2023 @04:52AM (#37107966)
The demand for small phone is completely overblown online.
Re:Ode to the M1 by LtWorf on Sunday August 13, 2023 @08:50AM (#37109496)
Because people who don't go online need BIGGER phones? For what?
Re:Ode to the M1 by paulmd on Sunday August 13, 2023 @02:46PM (#37112858)
Objectively he’s right and there’s a reason the iPhone mini was discontinued. The demand for mini phones is niche but very loud online. It isn’t economical to support a mainstream product for the handful of people who are actually willing to pay for that specific niche feature point.

Kinda like headphone ports and microSD slots on android phones. Are there models that do this? Yes! Is anyone willing to pay more for it? No! But they are very very loud online about it.

There do exist smaller android phones as well, just like a headphone port nothing is stopping you from buying one instead of complaining on the internet!

Re:Ode to the M1 by LtWorf on Sunday August 13, 2023 @05:41PM (#37114825)
People want a small phone, but perhaps not if it costs like 6 phones? How is this hard to understand?

> Is anyone willing to pay more for it? No!

Is anyone willing to pick a phone over another (despite what paulmd's opinion might be)? YES.

> There do exist smaller android phones as well

No they don't. There is NOTHING on the market currently that is sized and priced like a samsung S5 mini today.

Re:Ode to the M1 by paulmd on Sunday August 13, 2023 @05:58PM (#37114958)
> People want a small phone, but perhaps not if it costs like 6 phones? How is this hard to understand?

iphone mini wasn't priced like 6 phones, and it still didn't sell well. again, you can't seem to grapple with the reality here that what you want is a very niche thing and it doesn't sell well as a mass-market product regardless of price. that is, after all, why apple stopped making that size once again.

the iphone SE is about as small as the market wants. Below that is the domain of mini phones - which do exist, but mostly from smaller android vendors.

> No they don't. There is NOTHING on the market currently that is sized and priced like a samsung S5 mini today.

s5 mini: 131.1 x 64.8 x 9.1 mm

cubot pocket 3: 133.2 x 55 x 12.3mm

unihertz jelly pro: 92.4 × 43 × 13 mm

just with literally a few minutes of searching.

again: the whining is a lot more intense than the reality. you are being catered to, you just want a niche product to be as cheap or moreso than the mainstream products that sell a zillionty units.

Re:Ode to the M1 by LtWorf on Sunday August 13, 2023 @07:23PM (#37115640)
> iphone mini wasn't priced like 6 phones

Still costs 4x than regular android phones.

> you can't seem to grapple with the reality

You can't seem to grapple with the reality that 839€ for a phone is completely insane, and not everybody is a rich spoiled person like you.

> unihertz jelly pro: 92.4 × 43 × 13 mm

Funny… I am returning a unihertz because of software issues (default google apps just crashing)… sure it's small… but I implied that stuff must work.

> just with literally a few minutes of searching.

Too bad that being rich and spoiled didn't enrich your brain uh?

I hope it's ok for you that unlike you, I knew what I was talking about.

Re:Ode to the M1 by satvikpendem on Sunday August 13, 2023 @04:59AM (#37108010)
How do you know they care but have no choice? Are average people besides devs talking about how slow their web apps are?

For your small phone example, even Apple is cutting production of their smaller phones because not enough people are buying them. The entire premise really is overblown online.

Re:Ode to the M1 by LtWorf on Sunday August 13, 2023 @08:52AM (#37109515)
> How do you know they care but have no choice?

You've ever heard a anyone say "This computer is too fast" or "this computer doesn't burn enough electricity"?

> For your small phone example, even Apple is cutting production of their smaller phones because not enough people are buying them.

Yeah I did mention "reasonably priced", which apple is not.

Re:Ode to the M1 by wiseowise on Sunday August 13, 2023 @04:51AM (#37107959)
> Practically no consumers care except for other software engineers complaining loudly on HN, and meanwhile companies save millions by not handcrafting their CRUD apps in assembly.

And you know that because you’ve analyzed whole market and know opinion of users of every web software? Definitely not because you only live in bubble of other software engineers so you’re not exposed to complaints of common folk?

Re:Ode to the M1 by satvikpendem on Sunday August 13, 2023 @04:56AM (#37107989)
No end consumers I know or even acquaintances of other people I know even know nor care about Electron. You might say that I'm in a bubble but at that point it's just the No True Scotsman fallacy.
Re:Ode to the M1 by wiseowise on Sunday August 13, 2023 @05:12AM (#37108104)
Literally all of my acquaintances in previous company complained about Teams being slow and buggy. I also see it constantly being mentioned online.
Re:Ode to the M1 by jauntywundrkind on Sunday August 13, 2023 @11:33AM (#37110908)
You can make slow & buggy software anywhere, with any stack. Teams themselves shipped a whole release focused around sucking significantly less & were getting much faster.

Discord has gotten pretty solid, vscode is spit fast. The hate against Electron feels so selective & antagonistic, picks it's targets, never acknowledged any value, never recognizes any points for the other side. It is just incredibly lopsidedly biased. Over what doesn't feel real to so many.

I was hoping Tauri would be the one, by using a shared library model. That would drop memory consumption down significantly. But they use webkit on Linux and I'm sorry but I want a much better base that supports more modern capabilities.

Re:Ode to the M1 by LtWorf on Sunday August 13, 2023 @08:54AM (#37109540)
They don't know how it's called, they still hate when they are forced to use slow applications.
Re:Ode to the M1 by OCASMv2 on Sunday August 13, 2023 @04:56AM (#37107987)
The arrogance to believe that their software is so well written already that the only way to improve their performance is by using handcrafted assembly.

Just changing their high level data structures alone would yield 10x improvements, easily.

Re:Ode to the M1 by presentation on Sunday August 13, 2023 @08:00AM (#37109091)
The naivete to believe that consumers driving company sales even realize that performance is something they need to care about.
Re:Ode to the M1 by OCASMv2 on Sunday August 13, 2023 @02:43PM (#37112830)
If they knew the main reason they have to shell out hundreds of dollars to upgrade their computers and phones is because of lazy/shoddy developers they would care.