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Re:Hydraulic Steering – Principles of Operation (1956) [video] by jeffrallen on Thursday July 27, 2023 @04:40PM (#36899834)
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Re:Hydraulic Steering – Principles of Operation (1956) [video] by kube-system on Thursday July 27, 2023 @05:00PM (#36900105)
> Also: this is not how modern power steering systems work.

Yes, most hydraulic systems today have been replaced by electric power steering, which uses electronic sensors to determine how much assist to apply via an electric motor. Mechanically, it is simple and very low maintenance.

Re:Hydraulic Steering – Principles of Operation (1956) [video] by genter on Thursday July 27, 2023 @05:06PM (#36900158)
Well, even before electric power steering became popular, rack and pinion steering was/is used in almost all passenger vehicles. The only vehicles that I can think of that use a steering gear and pitman arm like this video are 1 ton Ford/Chevy/Dodge and the Jeep Wrangler.
Re:Hydraulic Steering – Principles of Operation (1956) [video] by calvinmorrison on Thursday July 27, 2023 @06:55PM (#36901207)
Doesn't the XJ have a steering box as well?
Re:Hydraulic Steering – Principles of Operation (1956) [video] by genter on Thursday July 27, 2023 @08:29PM (#36901883)
I was only looking at vehicles from this millennia. 80 series Land Cruiser and 4wd Toyota trucks from the early 90's had a steering gear too, and I'm sure some others that I don't care about.
Re:Hydraulic Steering – Principles of Operation (1956) [video] by mauvehaus on Thursday July 27, 2023 @08:21PM (#36901821)
I thought recirculating ball[0] was commonly used in most passenger vehicles, and rack and pinion was more common in sports cars.

[0] https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Recirculating_ball

Re:Hydraulic Steering – Principles of Operation (1956) [video] by serf on Thursday July 27, 2023 @08:26PM (#36901854)
rack and pinion has been the standard for nearly all smaller passenger vehicles since at least the early 90s.

you can find things like that or like pitman arms on larger/industrial vehicles fairly commonly, though.

to your point, however, yes -- sports cars were the first ones to popularize the method. Rack and pinions tend to feel less 'sloppy' , especially after some use.

The idea stuck around in the industry though because it results in less customer complaints and requires less finesse from the mechanic during install/maintenance.

tuning a 'steering box' is a lost art relegated to hot-rod folks at this point.

Re:Hydraulic Steering – Principles of Operation (1956) [video] by mauvehaus on Thursday July 27, 2023 @08:53PM (#36902011)
So was recirculating ball a halfway point between worm and sector and rack and pinion then?

We have a 1947 Willys CJ-2A, which I believe is worm and sector, though we haven't gotten into the steering yet because there are so many other things wrong with it. Including, it seems, the formerly working brakes. I discovered they had crapped out as I was backing up near a bunch of formerly neatly stacked cinder blocks.

Re:Hydraulic Steering – Principles of Operation (1956) [video] by jeffrallen on Friday July 28, 2023 @01:22AM (#36903337)
Are you Mister Bean?
Re:Hydraulic Steering – Principles of Operation (1956) [video] by Daneel_ on Thursday July 27, 2023 @08:55PM (#36902019)
The only recent example I'm aware of is the Ineos Grenadier, and it's quite controversial as it means the steering is a) slow, and b) has very low self-centering (also a function of caster).
Re:Hydraulic Steering – Principles of Operation (1956) [video] by emptybits on Friday July 28, 2023 @02:49AM (#36903744)
Recirculating ball steering also probably won't allow for new fangled features like active lane-keep assist, collision avoidance steering, self-parking, etc. (Which is probably not missed anyways by the 4x4 crowd, including the Ineos Grenadier ideology.) Mercedes switched their G-Class away from recirculating ball steering just a few years ago and I bet, based on MSRP, that their primary use now is much less 4x4 and much more embracing of complex computerized features for urban crawling and highway touring.
Re:Hydraulic Steering – Principles of Operation (1956) [video] by midoridensha on Thursday July 27, 2023 @09:12PM (#36902091)
In 1975, your comment would be correct.

In 2005, it's horribly wrong.

Re:Hydraulic Steering – Principles of Operation (1956) [video] by Gibbon1 on Friday July 28, 2023 @02:15AM (#36903563)
I suspect that a problem with rack and pinion 'back in the day' was materials and manufacturing mean they would wear and the steering would get sloppy. Where recirculating ball naturally is low wear. Once they upped materials and manufacturing rack and pinion was simpler and cheaper.

I think for non power assist recirculating ball is nicer because it doesn't transmit road forces back to the driver like rack and pinion does. (Could be wrong)

Re:Hydraulic Steering – Principles of Operation (1956) [video] by serf on Thursday July 27, 2023 @08:33PM (#36901909)
>Yes, most hydraulic systems today have been replaced by electric power steering, which uses electronic sensors to determine how much assist to apply via an electric motor.

one small nit to pick

many modern electric power steering systems are still hydraulic by nature. It's sometimes the case that the electric motor is driving fluid to enact the resistance change. Many cars that use Bosch electronics/driving-aids still work this way, electro-hydraulic pumps in a feedback loop with pressure sensors/steering angle sensors/IMUs/vehicle dynamics sensors (speed/angle/yaw/etc).

That said, fluid-less electronic-exclusive systems now exist and are in common-use, so you're not wrong at all -- just pointing out that there are many ways to skin that cat.

Re:Hydraulic Steering – Principles of Operation (1956) [video] by hatsunearu on Thursday July 27, 2023 @11:43PM (#36902935)
are you sure? there's a lot of "normal" cars that are full EPAS. Like the Prius.

I know stuff like the MR2 is like that, but I'm guessing that's because the engine is in the wrong place to have normal power steering.

Re:Hydraulic Steering – Principles of Operation (1956) [video] by imtringued on Friday July 28, 2023 @04:38AM (#36904325)
>many modern electric power steering systems are still hydraulic by nature

No they aren't. I have a car with EPS (electronic power steering) and it isn't playing any tricks. It's just an electric motor. What you are talking about is EHPS (electro-hydraulic power steering). Stop mixing up your terminology.