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Re:To Make More Stingers, US Needs to Revive Production Tech... by cpursley on Saturday July 01, 2023 @04:17PM (#36554658)
Do you think the 30 year old B-2s will would be able to penetrate Russian air space? They've got quite the radar array and integrated air defense.
Re:To Make More Stingers, US Needs to Revive Production Tech... by armchairgen on Saturday July 01, 2023 @05:14PM (#36555302)
Do you think that the B-2 is the latest that the U.S. has[1]?

It doesn't need to be singularly successful since it's part of a collective of redundant systems[2]. Air isn't working then increase missile strikes, missiles can't attain good effect on target then increase covert operations with local insurgencies, etc.

That's just some of the possible angles of attack. There's leaving out things like drones and cyber attacks that would also be employed to some effect.

Eventually the enemy loses the ability to fight since it's critical points are weakened to such a point it can no longer wage an effective resistance.

Another example: why attack heavily defended artillery positions when you can blow up the logistical route and starve them of rounds to attack with?

[1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Northrop_Grumman_B-21_Raider [2] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Maneuver_warfare

Re:To Make More Stingers, US Needs to Revive Production Tech... by cpursley on Saturday July 01, 2023 @06:25PM (#36555976)
What you described is exactly what Russia is doing to NATO backed Ukraine.
Re:To Make More Stingers, US Needs to Revive Production Tech... by armchairgen on Saturday July 01, 2023 @06:34PM (#36556047)
How so?

How is Russia establishing air superiority over Ukraine now? Or is going to change the tempo of the war into their favor?

How does this pertain to them denying NATO+allies from probably eventually attaining air superiority in a hypothetical full conflict?

Re:To Make More Stingers, US Needs to Revive Production Tech... by cpursley on Saturday July 01, 2023 @08:06PM (#36556694)
Well, for one - with impunity, Russian choppers over the last month have decimated the Ukrainian counteroffensive attempts to the point of shocking even Western observers. This is partially due to greatly degraded Ukrainian air defense after an intentional multi-month bombing campaign (using missiles, not planes - meaning no dead pilots). And Russia has shown to be very effective at intercepting various modern weapons systems via EW or direct.
Re:To Make More Stingers, US Needs to Revive Production Tech... by armchairgen on Saturday July 01, 2023 @08:58PM (#36557045)
No one's doubting Russia has built a capable defense over the last year however that's not changing the direction of the war.

How many helicopters can Russia sustain to lose? They've lost several over the last few weeks.

Supply routes have be successfully attacked by Ukraine with estimates of slowing logistics by 50% in certain areas.

And again how many AA batteries can they sustain to lose?

Meanwhile Ukraine has made slow but steady advances forward gaining ground.

Where's Russia changing the direction? Is that by terrorizing civilian targets (your bombing campaign) and blowing up hydroelectric dams? So essentially they're just using the tactics of terrorists.

Yet they still can't freely fly over Ukraine because they still lack control over the skies.

When's Russia regaining the momentum in their favor? Last week one of their best units tried to storm Moscow and hang their top military leaders.

AND now Russia is more weakened to a full confrontation with NATO than they were before starting their war in Ukraine. So all the more likely to lose air superiority to NATO+allies.

Re:To Make More Stingers, US Needs to Revive Production Tech... by _kbh_ on Sunday July 02, 2023 @02:42AM (#36558910)
> And Russia has shown to be very effective at intercepting various modern weapons systems via EW or direct. Maybe they are evil incarnate, but they math good.

I dunno know about this part of the statement, the fact that we are still seeing long range deep strikes into important Russian territory (sometimes killing hundreds of soldiers at a time), tells me that maybe Russias EW and AA against semi modern cruise missiles isn't as good as people think.

Re:To Make More Stingers, US Needs to Revive Production Tech... by cpursley on Sunday July 02, 2023 @03:17AM (#36559088)
That doesn’t mean they have full coverage. The “front” is enormous.
Re:To Make More Stingers, US Needs to Revive Production Tech... by _kbh_ on Sunday July 02, 2023 @05:14AM (#36559743)
> That doesn’t mean they have full coverage. The “front” is enormous.

Yeah but these missile strikes have been hitting high value targets like air fields and troop barracks.

Regardless of if they can’t defend these areas because they don’t have the systems or the systems cannot intercept them it doesn’t bode well.

Re:To Make More Stingers, US Needs to Revive Production Tech... by greedo on Saturday July 01, 2023 @11:16PM (#36557892)
B-21 hasn't even had it's first flight...
Re:To Make More Stingers, US Needs to Revive Production Tech... by armchairgen on Saturday July 01, 2023 @11:26PM (#36557950)
That we publicly know of. Of course there's also drones. I don't understand why you're fixated on one or two things that were meant as possible examples of potential tactics that could be deployed. You're missing the forest which is ways for gaining air supremacy. Feels like you're just trying to argue to argue now.
Re:To Make More Stingers, US Needs to Revive Production Tech... by greedo on Saturday July 01, 2023 @11:15PM (#36557883)
Well, considering the reports coming out about how their radar systems have been deployed lacking the necessary gear (due to widespread corruption), I think that it's possible the B-2 could still penetrate. Russia's a huge country, and he who defends everything defends nothing.