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Re:Rust has been forked to the Crab Language by jacquesm on Tuesday May 30, 2023 @08:20AM (#36123929)
> Stallman can think or do whatever he wants, but he is not and has never been an effective advocate.

Stallman has been right more often then wrong and has made his points forcefully, consistent and without compromise over decades. He's backed up his words with his deeds, has contributed an incredible amount of software and has been a very important factor in jumpstarting the free software movement. He has convinced millions of programmers to give away the fruit of their labor for the betterment of the world in general and the relationship of end users with software in particular.

I really don't see what else one could wish for in an effective advocate.

Re:Rust has been forked to the Crab Language by arp242 on Tuesday May 30, 2023 @09:33AM (#36124693)
Someone who doesn't alienate a significant part of the community would be a good start (which all occurred long before the whole business with the Minsky comments). That he jump-started things or "is right" isn't actually all that important for effective advocacy; if I were to start my reply with "you asshole!" then you're not very likely to listen to what I have to say. To be honest I don't understand how people fail to understand there's a difference between "being right" and "being someone people listen to".
Re:Rust has been forked to the Crab Language by toyg on Tuesday May 30, 2023 @10:30AM (#36125291)
"Nobody listens to him" and still the likes of Microsoft now develop predominantly in the open.

You don't need to persuade everyone, sometimes it's just enough to witness your truth. Ask christians.

Re:Rust has been forked to the Crab Language by arp242 on Tuesday May 30, 2023 @10:54AM (#36125588)
> "Nobody listens to him" and still the likes of Microsoft now develop predominantly in the open.

Stallman had exactly zero influence on that shift.

Re:Rust has been forked to the Crab Language by toyg on Tuesday May 30, 2023 @11:48AM (#36126241)
That shift is the result of millions of other little shifts made over the last 4 decades, which he definitely had a hand in enabling.
Re:Rust has been forked to the Crab Language by psd1 on Tuesday May 30, 2023 @09:34AM (#36124704)
Not inducing the backlash effect, probably.

I have spent too long being right but an arsehole. I never got my ideas into production that way, even though the existing codebase was patently a trough of piss. I learned to stfu and, generally, they came round. Don't rub people's noses in it, especially if they make decisions you care about.

There is almost no issue so black-and-white that a person can't find a technical justification for any given point of view. So don't drive people to oppose you from simple bloody-mindedness.