News for hackers. Stuff that matters.
Re:“Forbidden-Word” Lists Are a Symptom of Administrative Bloat by andrewmcwatters on Wednesday March 08, 2023 @08:40AM (#35068829)
Of all of the corporate departments I perceive qualified to write “lists,” IT is perhaps rock bottom.

It seems to consistently result in visible productions of over reactions that are disconnected from reality.

For example deaf and blind people that I know of prefer to be called deaf or blind.

Brown bagging in my life time has always referred to making one’s own lunch and taking it to work or school in a paper brown bag.

Black box refers to an electrical literal black box which one is unable to see its implementation details without opening it.

The thinking of individuals who produce these works seems to seep into everything they perceive, and so ironically they shouldn’t be producing these lists.

Red, in my experience in most people’s minds, does not refer to Indians predominantly.

BIPOC seems to elevate “capital B” black people and “indigenous” people over others. This seems to be the current initialism in-vogue but I find it inappropriate.

I would err on creating too short of a list over an ever expanding one.

But I digress. That’s not the point of the article. Ideally we don’t have these at all. Not because of administrative bloat being something to avoid but because hopefully you learn how to speak to people with nuance as a result of living life and talking to people with different backgrounds and working continually on your own simple ethical decisions.

As a final comment, much of the social discussions we have in the states are really limited to US centric social perspectives.

People don’t talk like this in many other countries. There’s some irony in being so concerned about how one communicates with other communities that one doesn’t see how myopic this is on an international scale. It’s so American.

Re:“Forbidden-Word” Lists Are a Symptom of Administrative Bloat by mhuffman on Wednesday March 08, 2023 @08:47AM (#35068899)
>There’s some irony in being so concerned about how one communicates with other communities

That "concern" in modern United States is literally the end of your professional life! So these self-appointed thought and speech police have, and will employ without a second-thought just for twitter points, through social media, a way to amplify their power to the extent that they can do something previously impossible and end your career over a (possibly imagined) thought "crime" or speech "crime". So from that perspective, all the walking on eggshells and concern about this is absolutely real not just a socially imagined construct or idea.

Re:“Forbidden-Word” Lists Are a Symptom of Administrative Bloat by calvinmorrison on Wednesday March 08, 2023 @08:52AM (#35068956)
Generally speaking, this is only enforced upon political dissidents however. Black face is forgivable if you are Justin Trudeau, but not Billy Bob Conservative.
Re:“Forbidden-Word” Lists Are a Symptom of Administrative Bloat by mhuffman on Wednesday March 08, 2023 @09:02AM (#35069057)
I agree there seems to be some people that are immune to this, but it is capricious in application. if someone wants more reddit/tiktok/twitter points that day then even the most ardent ally to your specific leaning will be sacrificed to the internet point gods.
Re:“Forbidden-Word” Lists Are a Symptom of Administrative Bloat by version_five on Wednesday March 08, 2023 @09:12AM (#35069142)
The thing about having rules that everybody is constantly breaking is that they let you selectively enforce them on your enemies. Drug laws have been historically like this and used more against minorities e.g.

So when pictures surface of someone that the in crowd doesn't like is an old Halloween costume, they all play it up as if the person's a monster. Realistically, few if anyone actually care deep down, and so when the same thing happens to someone currently in favor, it's easy to let it slide.

The problem isn't that justin Trudeau (who I despise incidentally) got a pass for dressing up in a costume (which obviously wasn't remotely offensive in the context it was in), it's that other people's careers have been destroyed for the same thing.

Just like e.g. Bill Clinton "not inhaling" - nobody gives a shit if he smoked pot. But simultaneously thousands of people, mostly who are "undesirables" in the eyes of law enforcement for one reason or another get incarcerated for it.

Re:“Forbidden-Word” Lists Are a Symptom of Administrative Bloat by calvinmorrison on Wednesday March 08, 2023 @09:41AM (#35069484)
"Trudeau said he wore blackface “makeup” in high school to sing “Day-O,” a Jamaican folk song famously performed by African-American singer and civil rights activist Harry Belafonte. TIME has confirmed that a photo shows Trudeau at a school talent show wearing blackface and an afro wig." - TIME

Nah man that's just straight up blackface minstrel, extremely racist and bad. Sorry, you're confusing it with the other time he wore blackface.

Re:“Forbidden-Word” Lists Are a Symptom of Administrative Bloat by wonderwonder on Wednesday March 08, 2023 @12:09PM (#35071664)
Honestly though, why is this important? He meant no offense and no one was hurt. Should we advocate for ending his career because of something he did in highschool?
Re:“Forbidden-Word” Lists Are a Symptom of Administrative Bloat by calvinmorrison on Wednesday March 08, 2023 @01:11PM (#35072559)
almost Certainly not. We should only hold past indiscretions against people we have opposing political opinions with
Re:“Forbidden-Word” Lists Are a Symptom of Administrative Bloat by wonderwonder on Wednesday March 08, 2023 @01:21PM (#35072710)
Politically me and Trudeau are very far apart
Re:“Forbidden-Word” Lists Are a Symptom of Administrative Bloat by mhuffman on Wednesday March 08, 2023 @09:15AM (#35069172)
Very well put! Selective enforcement is the key here. When everyone doesn't get to play by the same rule or even know the rules in some cases, how do you have a functioning society?
Re:“Forbidden-Word” Lists Are a Symptom of Administrative Bloat by shadowgovt on Wednesday March 08, 2023 @10:38AM (#35070311)
Mostly the way we do right now: learn as one goes and pay attention.
Re:“Forbidden-Word” Lists Are a Symptom of Administrative Bloat by shadowgovt on Wednesday March 08, 2023 @10:37AM (#35070298)
The realpolitik of the thing is that when bad stuff comes out, the value people perceive the perpetrator brings is weighed against the bad stuff. In essence, cost of keeping them vs. cost of marginalizing them.

Some folks were just too valuable to marginalize. Some aren't. But that's pretty true of any space humans operate in, whether the bad stuff is Halloween costume choices or bad hygiene.

If there are a hundred Justin Trudeaus to choose from, the one that was racist gets left by the wayside (I think this is what scares people about this sort of thing... They realize they aren't special enough to step out of line).

Re:“Forbidden-Word” Lists Are a Symptom of Administrative Bloat by ParetoOptimal on Wednesday March 08, 2023 @10:39AM (#35070316)
Blackface is unforgivable for both. Words matter. You'll be fine replacing master/slave with main/secondary.
Re:“Forbidden-Word” Lists Are a Symptom of Administrative Bloat by kodah on Wednesday March 08, 2023 @07:26PM (#35076710)
It's worth reading this persons Twitter: https://twitter.com/ParetoOptimal_
Re:“Forbidden-Word” Lists Are a Symptom of Administrative Bloat by Nextgrid on Wednesday March 08, 2023 @09:13AM (#35069151)
Problem is that with so much free money floating around, a large chunk of IT and especially startups was never about running a profitable business but about perpetuating a ponzi scheme running on investor money doubling as a daycare center for employees, since there was never any actual market pressure to operate profitably.

You don't see as much of this in other industries where most companies are busy making actual money (or they will get out-competed by companies who care about their bottom-line more than virtue-signalling).

Re:“Forbidden-Word” Lists Are a Symptom of Administrative Bloat by recursivedoubts on Wednesday March 08, 2023 @09:19AM (#35069220)
The irony of the whole thing is that these language power games are, in part, pushed on IT/development exactly because IT/devs typically have relatively low social status/institutional power, when compared with, for example, sales.
Re:“Forbidden-Word” Lists Are a Symptom of Administrative Bloat by itronitron on Wednesday March 08, 2023 @02:00PM (#35073267)
Those who can't, teach.

Those who can't teach, teach Gym.

Those who can't teach Gym, make lists of forbidden words.

Re:“Forbidden-Word” Lists Are a Symptom of Administrative Bloat by theshrike79 on Thursday March 09, 2023 @05:16AM (#35079876)
When I read BIPOC, my brain goes to "bisexual person of color". Every. Single. Time.

Actually as I'm writing this I still draw a blank what it's actually meant to be. But Americans love their acronyms.