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Re:Seattle becomes first U.S. city to ban caste discrimination by jdmtheNth on Wednesday February 22, 2023 @08:50AM (#34895391)
This is why America was intended to be a melting pot: so that cultural baggage could be left behind. Complete waste of resources just to demonstrate how progressive the city is.
Re:Seattle becomes first U.S. city to ban caste discrimination by ubermonkey on Wednesday February 22, 2023 @09:02AM (#34895601)
Your comment puzzles me.

I read caste bullshit as baggage to be left behind, but then you seem to suggest that the measure is a waste of resources. What's your point?

Re:Seattle becomes first U.S. city to ban caste discrimination by Izkata on Wednesday February 22, 2023 @10:12AM (#34896787)
It's been drifting from melting pot to multiculturalism for (at least) the past few decades - distinct independent cultures that interact with each other, without leaving the baggage behind.
Re:Seattle becomes first U.S. city to ban caste discrimination by btown on Wednesday February 22, 2023 @09:12AM (#34895766)
Multiple things can be true at the same time: that a majority of individuals in a country want the country to be accepting of all its people, and that governmental support can be additive to individual action and non-governmental community organization to make that dream a reality.

It's almost like progress towards a world where everyone is free to be themselves, regardless of cultural baggage and prejudices as you say, requires a plan and an alliance of stakeholders. What would we call such a plan... perhaps we could add some kind of suffix onto the word progress?

Re:Seattle becomes first U.S. city to ban caste discrimination by saiya-jin on Wednesday February 22, 2023 @09:25AM (#34896002)
I don't think anything was intended, it just happened due to historical facts. US in the meantime invented its own class systems - income/wealth you have, university you went to etc.

And of course skin color in the past that it still struggles to shed off (every US person of asian origin I've met while backpacking complained to me how its great the progress black minority receives, but they feel left behind and much more exposed to racism).

People really don't need much to look down on different others, I'd say its still part of human nature.

Re:Seattle becomes first U.S. city to ban caste discrimination by causi on Wednesday February 22, 2023 @10:03AM (#34896633)
every US person of asian origin I've met while backpacking complained to me how its great the progress black minority receives, but they feel left behind and much more exposed to racism

Is there any group in the US who doesn't feel, on average, that they are the most discriminated-against?

Re:Seattle becomes first U.S. city to ban caste discrimination by lern_too_spel on Wednesday February 22, 2023 @02:30PM (#34901296)
Most of the people of Asian origin I've met have been happy that the civil rights fought for mainly by black Americans before them helped them as well. This is an economic class issue. Lower class people of any race hate other races and blame them (and other people generally) for their problems.
Re:Seattle becomes first U.S. city to ban caste discrimination by bena on Wednesday February 22, 2023 @09:14AM (#34895805)
From what I understand, it is a problem in the tech sphere. But caste is not a protected class because it should not exist here. So, depending on how this law is written, it could extend anti-discrimination protections to groups that otherwise don't have it at the moment.
Re:Seattle becomes first U.S. city to ban caste discrimination by PM_me_your_math on Wednesday February 22, 2023 @08:58AM (#34895538)
They have to show they are doing something because they are not doing anything else.
Re:Seattle becomes first U.S. city to ban caste discrimination by yeahbutiguess on Wednesday February 22, 2023 @09:03AM (#34895607)
Seattle is doing tons of stuff. They recently upzoned a huge amount of the city, approved ranked choice voting, approved social housing, expanded rail, fixed a major bridge failure before it failed, and plenty more.

Crime rates are down, the city has grown astronomically, etc.

Re:Seattle becomes first U.S. city to ban caste discrimination by the_doctah on Wednesday February 22, 2023 @09:25AM (#34895980)
I had a feeling your claim about crime rate was untrue so I googled it. It turned out to be wildly untrue. Crime rates are way up.

https://www.seattletimes.com/seattle-news/law-justice/seattl...

It's a "soft on crime" blue city. Crime doesn't go down.

Re:Seattle becomes first U.S. city to ban caste discrimination by yeahbutiguess on Wednesday February 22, 2023 @09:28AM (#34896049)
https://www.seattletimes.com/seattle-news/data/is-seattle-dy...

Look at these graphs. Crime has consistently fallen.

The article you linked is discussing a recent uptick after a stable period of low crime. They've cherry picked the statistics to not show the huge drop in crime over the past 40 years.

Yes, crime is down in Seattle.

Re:Seattle becomes first U.S. city to ban caste discrimination by the_doctah on Wednesday February 22, 2023 @09:30AM (#34896086)
Re:Seattle becomes first U.S. city to ban caste discrimination by yeahbutiguess on Wednesday February 22, 2023 @09:46AM (#34896364)
I have. I've lived here for nearly 40 years. I've been active in politics here and I've experience with both the data and the anecdotes.

Seattle has less crime then it did 40, 30, and 20 years ago. The past three years were exceptional and the report does indicate increased rates of violent crime.

But we had a global pandemic, a contentious election, a spotlight on police brutality, etc.

I guess you can make the call, whether you think that's a trend or an anomaly, but when I look at the data I see us having a crime rate half of what it used to be, with an uptick in the most unusual years in a generation.

Re:Seattle becomes first U.S. city to ban caste discrimination by the_doctah on Wednesday February 22, 2023 @09:57AM (#34896527)
What do you think that Seattle is doing right to combat crime?
Re:Seattle becomes first U.S. city to ban caste discrimination by zardo on Wednesday February 22, 2023 @12:50PM (#34899641)
They still have cops, courts, and jails in Seattle.
Re:Seattle becomes first U.S. city to ban caste discrimination by edgyquant on Wednesday February 22, 2023 @10:01AM (#34896594)
So when faced with proof you lied your defense is to say that your anecdotal evidence is better than state? Give me a break.
Re:Seattle becomes first U.S. city to ban caste discrimination by 206lol on Wednesday February 22, 2023 @10:12AM (#34896781)
They supplied data from the state showing the longer trend line. Scroll up a few comments.

Both posters are correct, and supplied data.

Crime rates are half what they used to be, that's true. Crime rates have also gone up very recently, that's also true.

No need to be so hostile.

Re:Seattle becomes first U.S. city to ban caste discrimination by giraffe_lady on Wednesday February 22, 2023 @10:20AM (#34896933)
Read this report by a group strongly incentivized to and rewarded by a creation of the perception that crime is high, about how high you should perceive crime to be.
Re:Seattle becomes first U.S. city to ban caste discrimination by the_doctah on Wednesday February 22, 2023 @10:25AM (#34897012)
Where I'm from we call it a "primary source".
Re:Seattle becomes first U.S. city to ban caste discrimination by giraffe_lady on Wednesday February 22, 2023 @11:52AM (#34898469)
When you learned how to use primary sources did they teach you to take them at face value without any consideration of the purpose, goals, constraints, and motivations of the people who created them?
Re:Seattle becomes first U.S. city to ban caste discrimination by the_doctah on Wednesday February 22, 2023 @12:01PM (#34898617)
I'm curious what other source you would even reference in this situation? Also do you really think the police intentionally misreport numbers that make themselves look bad?
Re:Seattle becomes first U.S. city to ban caste discrimination by giraffe_lady on Wednesday February 22, 2023 @12:15PM (#34898921)
I doubt there's a single trustworthy authoritative source that presents a complete picture. I'm not saying completely ignore or dismiss what the police say, but consider it in its context as one piece of information, published by an organization with its own needs and biases, rather than the single defining instance.

Police definitely lie a lot, and invest significant resources in outreach and PR, which we would straightforwardly call propaganda if someone else was doing it. The motivations are probably more complex than just what makes them look bad. And the mechanisms are probably more sophisticated than simply publishing completely false data in a report.

> Also do you really think the police intentionally misreport numbers that make themselves look bad?

But basically yes I do.

Re:Seattle becomes first U.S. city to ban caste discrimination by edgyquant on Wednesday February 22, 2023 @10:00AM (#34896580)
Social housing is a horrible idea and it only passed because voter turnout is so low. Seattle is doing a lot of nothing and anyone living here can tell you that.
Re:Seattle becomes first U.S. city to ban caste discrimination by phillipcarter on Wednesday February 22, 2023 @10:53AM (#34897500)
Metro resident since 2015 here, aside from rising home prices just about everything has gotten better for me. Expanded transit, light rail will be within walking distance of my house in 2 years, better food and restaurants, incredible schools for the future with kids, etc. That doesn't happen because people sit around with their thumbs up their butts.
Re:Seattle becomes first U.S. city to ban caste discrimination by majinuub on Wednesday February 22, 2023 @09:58AM (#34896556)
I disagree that America was intended to be a melting pot. That idea came later. It was intended to be a federation of Christian, culturally English states.
Re:Seattle becomes first U.S. city to ban caste discrimination by prh8 on Wednesday February 22, 2023 @10:04AM (#34896637)
A melting pot means that everything (everyone) assimilates to the majority. That's not really what America was intended to be, but it is what a large part of the population wants it to be.
Re:Seattle becomes first U.S. city to ban caste discrimination by aqme28 on Wednesday February 22, 2023 @10:06AM (#34896691)
I don't understand your comment. We agree that caste discrimination is bad and should be "left behind," but you don't want laws passed about that?

It feels like you're saying "things should be this way, so I assume that they already are" rather than "things should be this way, so let's construct laws that encourage that."

Re:Seattle becomes first U.S. city to ban caste discrimination by nescioquid on Wednesday February 22, 2023 @11:03AM (#34897677)
If you start with the presumption that anti-discrimination laws already exist, then you may see this law as merely performative -- it didn't outlaw anything that was actually permitted prior.

But it could also be that such a redundant law is part of an broader acculturation process, and so has more cultural, rather than legal value.

Re:Seattle becomes first U.S. city to ban caste discrimination by zardo on Wednesday February 22, 2023 @12:48PM (#34899572)
But... caste based employment discrimination is (arguably in court) permitted in the US. Discrimination protections are only for categories specified and caste isn't specified.
Re:Seattle becomes first U.S. city to ban caste discrimination by ravenstine on Wednesday February 22, 2023 @10:16AM (#34896847)
> This is why America was intended to be a melting pot:

That's really a concept that manifested much later in American history. By no means was it intended to be a "melting pot" from the very start, or even the first 1/3 of its existence.

Re:Seattle becomes first U.S. city to ban caste discrimination by 22SAS on Wednesday February 22, 2023 @01:54PM (#34900730)
Most immigration to the US was white based till 1965.
Re:Seattle becomes first U.S. city to ban caste discrimination by hannasanarion on Wednesday February 22, 2023 @10:26AM (#34897026)
How is it simultaneously a good thing for caste systems to be annihilated in immigrant communities, and a bad thing to annihilate caste systems in immigrant communities?