Eugh, god, no. It isnt ostracism if you are being asked to go outside because you want to light something on fire.

That being said you arent alone in this desire. The work around appears to be clubs with a membership fee and volunteer bartenders (at least where I live). If its something that pops up for you frequently then it might be worthwhile to pursue.

>On the other hand, being constantly ostracised from public spaces isn’t great either

Yes, it is. I think it's a great thing. If you don't like it, then stop trying to subject everyone around you to your nasty cancer-causing habit. Careless people like you deserve to be stuck out in the cold.

Can we chill on the hate? Be impassioned, sure. But this 'people like you deserve' is not welcome. You arent going to convince a smoker tgeyre wrong by being a shining example of the prototypical asshole non smoker

Hate is what these people love, it elevates their virtue and allows them to look down upon anyone they disagree with.

Just look at the people who questioned the vaccine. Hordes were calling for those people to be locked up, jailed, isolated from the population, denied medical care, denied basic access to needs (like grocery shopping) and even fired from their job.

These people have absolutely no regard for _anyone_ that disagrees with them. It's very sad.

I see no reason to be polite to someone who complains he can't force other people to breathe his cancerous emissions any more.

Making these people pariahs and social outcasts is one of the big things that reduced smoking so much in North America, and thereby saved a lot of people from the health effects of secondhand smoke from these selfish assholes.

Mods will probably remove your comments but I agree with everything you said.

I think the real issue here is this topic being discussed on HackerNews of all places.

Screw you too buddy.

Edit: Just to be clear, thanks to this smug, pompous, "holier than thou" post of yours, I'm going to go out of my way to blow smoke in people's faces the next time I'm at a bar entrance. Congrats on your contribution to second-hand smoke.

Being rude to uninvolved strangers isn't improving anything.

Congrats, you just proved you're the asshole and I was right about what a piece of shit you are for forcing your cancerous chemicals on everyone around you, and then complaining when they decided you weren't welcome around them while you were lighting up.

Can’t we all just agree that you’re both assholes?

Please don't break the site guidelines like this. You may not owe cancer-causing habit-holders better, but you owe this community better if you're participating in it.

If you'd please review https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html and stick to the rules when posting here, we'd appreciate it.

When all bars allowed smoking, all bars were the same. Then there came a govt ban on smoking in bars. So all bars are the same. (they all wailed loudly, but because it applied equally clientele had nowhere else to go.)

As a non smoker there are now options to go out I never had before. Restaurants are now safe again. (well except for parents who think it's OK for a child to be on a phone playing games at full audio volume, but we'll save that rant for another day.)

> On the other hand, being constantly ostracised from public spaces isn’t great either… something I find infuriating when I travel abroad. If there were at least a few smoking bars where you don’t have to go out into the cold to smoke I think that would be nice.

I'm a smoker, and I absolutely don't want smoking allowed in public indoor places, and some outdoor public places as well. I don't smoke indoors even in my own home.

On the other hand, when I duck down an empty alley and light up, I'm going to be annoyed if someone walking on the main road comes in to complain about how my second-hand smoke is going to give them cancer.

Too many times I have had people go out of their way to inhale my second hand smoke, and then complain about it.

> Too many times I have had people go out of their way to inhale my second hand smoke, and then complain about it.

Too many times I have had people go out of their way to walk in front of my 3 ton truck driving 100 mph in a pedestrian zone to almost get hit, and then complain about it.

> Too many times I have had people go out of their way to walk in front of my 3 ton truck driving 100 mph in a pedestrian zone to almost get hit, and then complain about it.

Maybe you shouldn't be doing 100mph around other people.

Sure, if you stop smoking around other people ;-)

> Sure, if you stop smoking around other people ;-)

Maybe english is not your first language, but you did read what I wrote, right? You did read my post saying that I get annoyed at people who go up to lone smokers and then complain?

You know what that means, right? It literally means "I don't smoke around other people!"

I'm afraid I am unable to simplify it any further.

My point is if you are the user/owner of a device capable of killing (huge car, cigarettes) there’s a big responsibility on you to prevent harm on others.

There’s always a grey area, but generally I’d say in a public space it’s the smoker who should actively move to avoid non-smokers.

What great hyperbole. This is possibly the strongest hyperbole in the _history of the universe!_

If you’re allowed to smoke in the bar then I’m allowed to bring my bucket of rotten fish.

All health issues aside, it’s just disgusting. It smells awful, it makes everything else smell awful. I always hate ending up in an elevator with a smoker, it’s nauseating. It truly is a disgusting habit.