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Re:Study Finds That Buttons in Cars Are Safer and Quicker to... by wolrah on Saturday January 07, 2023 @11:42AM (#34289728)
> You do know that Touch Screen got included in Cars due to government regulations right? The government mandated Backup Camera's and once you had to put in a screen to serve as display for the backup camera then it only makes since to use that screen for more and more things

Backup cameras were mandated in the US in 2018. Almost every vehicle on the market had a touchscreen years before that. The few vehicles I can think of that didn't yet have a screen as standard by that point got in-mirror camera displays to comply.

A government regulation that was announced in 2014 and took effect in 2018 had nothing to do with my 2015 Fiesta, which does not have a backup camera, having the same touch screen a 2010 model had.

Ford introduced MyFordTouch in 2010. Chrysler's Uconnect system came out in 2011, GM's various systems (CUE, MyLink, etc) in 2012, and of course the big daddy of stupid touch-focused designs the Tesla Model S came out in 2013. All of these were well established across entire lineups by the time backup camera regulations were being discussed.

The primary reason for the current state of automotive touch interfaces is entirely capitalism doing what it does. Touch interfaces are more expensive than a few buttons, but they can replace hundreds of individual controls and components that all have their own design, testing, and production requirements with one where almost everything about it can be changed on the fly. A model that offers options for heated seats as well as heated/cooled seats means you have three different sets of buttons for whatever panel those go in, three different sets of control boards, etc. With touch controls, as bad as they are to use those three variants are now effectively free to the manufacturer. They "cost" a few if()s in software.

Regulation is in fact the only reason this nonsense hasn't gotten even stupider. Tesla's new models have a set of hidden controls for drive mode selection and hazard lights, which are primarily intended to be controlled via the touch screen, because they are legally required to have something that would work without the screen.

https://www.motortrend.com/news/tesla-model-s-plaid-shifter/

Let me repeat that, Tesla does not want to have these controls, the only reason they have them is because regulation forces them to. Tell me again how the big bad government is ruining Tesla's freedom to do the stupidest things...

Re:Study Finds That Buttons in Cars Are Safer and Quicker to... by phpisthebest on Saturday January 07, 2023 @11:51AM (#34289843)
>>Tesla does not want to have these controls, the only reason they have them is because regulation forces them to. Tell me again how the big bad government is ruining Tesla's freedom to do the stupidest things

You think the stupidest thing, I am not anti-touch screen like most here are. In-fact I replaced alot of the factory buttons in my older car with a Aftermarket Large display that is basically a huge android tablet that controls alot of the car functions (including HVAC)

I prefer touch controls.

Why the government preventing me from choosing the control I like the best, and then you can feel free to not buy a car that does not have physical controls.

That is the market. that is how it should be.

Re:Study Finds That Buttons in Cars Are Safer and Quicker to... by messe on Saturday January 07, 2023 @11:58AM (#34289938)
> Why the government preventing me from choosing the control I like the best

For the same reason you can't drive while on the phone or drunk. If it's less safe than buttons, it's putting others in unnecessary danger.

Re:Study Finds That Buttons in Cars Are Safer and Quicker to... by phpisthebest on Saturday January 07, 2023 @12:08PM (#34290089)
I am sure you are not going to agree or like my response to this argument then.

It should be incumbent upon the driver to learn how to operate their car safely. If our ultimate goals are to maximize highway safety, we should be punishing reckless driving. It shouldn't matter if it's caused by alcohol, sleep deprivation, prescription medication, text messaging, or Touch Screens. If lawmakers want to stick it to dangerous drivers who threaten everyone else on the road, they can dial up the civil and criminal liability for reckless driving, especially in cases that result in injury or property damage.

The punishable act should be violating road rules or causing an accident, not the factors that led to those offenses.

//Some statements herein are rephrased / updated statements from "Abolish Drunk Driving Laws" https://reason.com/2010/10/11/abolish-drunk-driving-laws-2/

Re:Study Finds That Buttons in Cars Are Safer and Quicker to... by messe on Saturday January 07, 2023 @12:22PM (#34290255)
You're right. I'm not.

I'm not even convinced you're arguing in good faith any more, because frankly I can't imagine how a rational and empathetic individual could have reasoned themselves into these opinions.

I'm not going to argue with you any more, because you're either a troll, or someone to who can't be reasoned out of their opinions simply because they didn't reason themselves into them.

Re:Study Finds That Buttons in Cars Are Safer and Quicker to... by phpisthebest on Saturday January 07, 2023 @12:52PM (#34290602)
>>I can't imagine how a rational and empathetic

Empathy and rationality are often in conflict, you seem to side more on the empathetic side where I do not. I am purely on the logical / rational side and freely admit to having very low Empathy.

>>someone to who can't be reasoned out of their opinions simply because they didn't reason themselves

I literally linked to a site called Reason.com.... It provides a very reasoned case for the abolishment of Drunk driving laws, and the unintended consequences to civil liberties those laws have created. (similar to the consequence to civil liberties the war on drugs has caused)

I think I have very reasoned and logical positions that are not based at all in empathy or emotion, which IMO is where all government regulation and law should be, devoid of emotion. Laws created because of emotional response are almost universally bad laws.

Re:Study Finds That Buttons in Cars Are Safer and Quicker to... by Animatronio on Saturday January 07, 2023 @02:08PM (#34291456)
For a site called reason the article surely is dumb AF. First the author argues back and forth about BAC levels. Maybe it should be .05? Or .08? Or something else? Well how about 0.00 as is in many other countries?? Then he somehow misses the fact that BAC levels can be deduced from blood samples taken hours after the actual police stop. No wonder they let him go in 2011.
Re:Study Finds That Buttons in Cars Are Safer and Quicker to... by watwut on Saturday January 07, 2023 @02:59PM (#34292011)
Logic and rationality are not inherently opposed to empathy.

That being said, one does not need to be empath to value not causing accidents to other people. "This will lead to more accidents" is both logical and rational claim.

The ideological investment into idea that one must be selfish to max to look "logical" is irrational.

Re:Study Finds That Buttons in Cars Are Safer and Quicker to... by phpisthebest on Saturday January 07, 2023 @04:31PM (#34293065)
Now where do I, nor the link, advocate for ignoring accidents to other people. In fact the goal is to actually lessen them which I and others advocate is not the actual goal of people pursing some of these regulations. Control and power seems to be the control. In the case of DUI laws in the US it seems to be primary born out of the desire to get around 4th amendment search provisions not about safety

I fail to see how advocating for very harsh punishment for people that cause accidents to other people, including prison and revocation of driving license has been twisted here to be something that is illogical and disregarding to others.

I also fail to understand why a person should not have the responsibility upon buying a vehicle to understand how to operate it safely, no matter if the interface is a Button or Touch screen. Do we give a pass to someone if they were fumbling with buttons? It is insanity to me how much society has drifted away from personal responsibility to everything being everyone else's fault

Re:Study Finds That Buttons in Cars Are Safer and Quicker to... by watwut on Saturday January 07, 2023 @06:09PM (#34294024)
I did not said that you advocated "ignoring accidents". You was against regulation against making it safer, with argument that punishing those who make mistakes or cause accidents harder is better option.

Then you created dichotomy between "empathy" and rationality, while responding to person accusing you of missing both.

Then you literally made strawman arguing I wrote something else then I wrote.