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Re:The strange case of Britain’s demise by tobylane on Saturday December 17, 2022 @10:11AM (#34028361)
I don’t think overwhelming is the right word, his vote share was around Blair’s average.

Now that half of Tory MPs have been cabinet members, it’s harder to demand loyalty by dangling a job for votes. Especially the ministerial roles that the public are aware of.

The article seems to be avoiding the term "lame duck period". It reads an excessively selective set of opinions, and it's unclear who should be trying harder.

Re:The strange case of Britain’s demise by petesergeant on Saturday December 17, 2022 @10:20AM (#34028432)
> his vote share was around Blair’s average

Blair got 35% of the vote after 8 years of power and the Iraq war, against a decent challenger and experienced politician.

Corbyn got 32% — as the opposition — against an incumbent who’s approval ratings at the time were underwater and who led an unpopular party who’d been in power far too long already.

Re:The strange case of Britain’s demise by orhmeh09 on Saturday December 17, 2022 @10:25AM (#34028475)
Blair wasn’t being sabotaged by his own party that bought Facebook ads to sabotage him. I’d say Corbyn did superbly. https://www.politicshome.com/news/article/labour-hq-spent-50...
Re:The strange case of Britain’s demise by petesergeant on Saturday December 17, 2022 @11:06AM (#34028947)
> I’d say Corbyn did superbly

Poe's law never fails

Re:The strange case of Britain’s demise by midasuni on Saturday December 17, 2022 @05:11PM (#34032803)
He did superbly in granting a massive majority to Johnson. If that was his goal (“win the argument” but not the election) then you can’t really fault him.
Re:The strange case of Britain’s demise by pydry on Sunday December 18, 2022 @05:28AM (#34036422)
He also didn't kiss Murdoch's ring. Being principled really screwed him over.
Re:The strange case of Britain’s demise by tobylane on Saturday December 17, 2022 @10:23AM (#34028465)
Yes, I missed out the bit where that 3% difference in vote lead to a 93 (out of 650) difference in seats.
Re:The strange case of Britain’s demise by iso1631 on Saturday December 17, 2022 @11:02AM (#34028904)
Corbyn got 202 MPs in 2019, Blair in his 3rd term got 355

Corbyn wasn't just deeply unpopular across the country outside of student areas. I spoke to life long remainer lib dems in the Tory/Lab marginal seat of Crewe and Nantwich who were voting Tory to stop Corbyn. Across rural areas in Cheshire people were voting Tory because they were scared of Lib Dems backing Corbyn.

Due to the way that FPTP works, his concentrated support in student/young urban areas was wasted, with the result being a Tory landslide.

Re:The strange case of Britain’s demise by petesergeant on Saturday December 17, 2022 @11:04AM (#34028932)
> life long remainer lib dems

This describes me. Luckily I was able to meaningfully vote LibDem, because I really could not see myself voting for BoJo or Corbyn in the last election. Neither Starmer nor Sunak would be my first choice, but in contrast I could hold my nose and vote for either of them if I had to.

Re:The strange case of Britain’s demise by blitzar on Saturday December 17, 2022 @11:56PM (#34035171)
> I spoke to life long remainer lib dems in the Tory/Lab marginal seat of Crewe and Nantwich who were voting Tory to stop Corbyn.

I spoke to many who similarly voted to stop Corbyn - they were stopping Corbyn because of his vow to reintroduce gas chambers and exterminate every Jew in the land. I am not sure that was his actual policy but many were adamant it was.

Re:The strange case of Britain’s demise by sph on Sunday December 18, 2022 @03:30AM (#34035969)
I'm no fan of Corbyn but there was a politically motivated character assassination leading up to the election, where all major newspapers reported him and his party for anti-Semitism. The media all parroting lines fed by the Government with no critical analysis is complicit in Tories, and whoever wants to play the dirtiest, to remain in power and do whatever they want.

The naive elector sees Corbyn pissing off the Jewish groups on front pages everywhere, and or course they do not want to associate with people of that ilk. The majority trust newspapers and politicians too much, so get routinely played like a fiddle, and the best liar always wins.

The similar shit show is going to play out next election with Reform UK if the liar extraordinaire Nigel Farage decides to front it.

Re:The strange case of Britain’s demise by iso1631 on Sunday December 18, 2022 @05:47AM (#34036506)
There's this view amongst Corbyn supporters that everyone would have voted for him if it wasn't for the evil newspapers.

Setting aside that in 2019 under 15% of the country read a newspaper, it's a moot point. Part of the job of being leader of a political party, just like any business, is to handle public relations. Corbyn's team was awful at this. It's no good whining about it, you have to handle it.

Personally his pro-wealthy attacks on making the care system fairer were one major thing that turned me off. He spent a lot of political capital trying to defend the right of millionaires to not pay for their own care (and thus increasing everyone else's tax burden).

Re:The strange case of Britain’s demise by Jochim on Sunday December 18, 2022 @07:12AM (#34036975)
I don't want millionaires to pay for their own care. I want to tax them more than it'd cost them to pay for that care privately.

Millionaires paying for their own care is how you end up with a terrible, underfunded, and eventually privatised public care system.

Re:The strange case of Britain’s demise by iso1631 on Sunday December 18, 2022 @12:53PM (#34040211)
Corbyn's proposal to actually tax millionaires failed dramatically because of his inability to handle the media.

Despite it being a policy supported by all sorts of economic think tanks from the IFS to Adam Smith, and has support from the Green party to the LSE, somehow he managed to completely bungle it and push the cause back a generation. Another thing I can't forgive him for.

Re:The strange case of Britain’s demise by blitzar on Tuesday December 20, 2022 @08:04AM (#34065286)
The problem is more extreme than that - there is not being able to handle the media, and there is Corbyns problem. "Informed voters" are able to precisely articulate what they believe the oposition party (Corbyns) policy is, and what they articulate is not based on any reality that exists on the time space continuum.

I recall at some point last election cycle an interview with a very passionate gentleman in the north who was adamant that we had to "Vote for Change, its time to get Corbyn and his failed policies out of Downing Street". He was utterly certain that Corbyn had been prime minister for the prior four years and the terrible state of the country was down to him.

I am no fan of labour but that environment is not good for anyone and has ultimately (ironically) destroyed the Conservative party.

Re:The strange case of Britain’s demise by mbg721 on Tuesday December 20, 2022 @08:12AM (#34065385)
If you think that's bad, you wouldn't believe all the crazy stuff people believe Donald Trump did while in office. If you took the name off and got rid of all the self-promotion and bombastic media stuff, people would think of him like an obscure post-Civil-War president you have to know for school and can forget after that.
Re:The strange case of Britain’s demise by blitzar on Tuesday December 20, 2022 @09:15AM (#34066167)
Let me guess ... he was (personally) running a child sex trafficing ring out of the basement of a pizza place?
Re:The strange case of Britain’s demise by pydry on Sunday December 18, 2022 @04:27AM (#34036211)
Blair had the support of the media (especially Murdoch, whose ring he kissed) and the career politicians and bureaucrats in his own party.

The career politicians, the party functionaries and virtually the entire media had their daggers out for Corbyn.

The 2017 election was a different story. The elites hadn't closed ranks at that point.

Re:The strange case of Britain’s demise by nailer on Saturday December 17, 2022 @10:24AM (#34028466)
Re:The strange case of Britain’s demise by tim333 on Saturday December 17, 2022 @10:48AM (#34028745)
"Jeremy Corbyn 'most unpopular opposition leader of past 45 years', says poll"

https://www.politicshome.com/news/article/jeremy-corbyn-most...

I'm not sure it's really fair but that's kinda how the polls went.

Re:The strange case of Britain’s demise by TapWaterBandit on Saturday December 17, 2022 @05:44PM (#34033061)
I'm astounded people are STILL burying their heads in the sand about Corbyn. But I suppose that is a large part of the reason why labour was losing for so long they kept denying the obvious reality that the electorate just did not like Corbyn but wouldn't get rid of him for internal political/ideological reasons.
Re:The strange case of Britain’s demise by akiselev on Saturday December 17, 2022 @05:59PM (#34033154)
There’s only one meme in British politics seen more often than Malcolm Tucker quotes: “It’s Corbyn’s fault!”

It’s febrile at this point.

Re:The strange case of Britain’s demise by TapWaterBandit on Saturday December 17, 2022 @06:53PM (#34033539)
> It’s febrile at this point.

Not really sure what you're saying here. Did you mean to use the word "juvenile"?

Re:The strange case of Britain’s demise by atchoo on Saturday December 17, 2022 @08:10PM (#34034056)
"Febrile" is basically a UK Politics meme after being used by journos to describe the "atmosphere in Westminster" during each crisis of the week.
Re:The strange case of Britain’s demise by akiselev on Saturday December 17, 2022 @08:15PM (#34034086)
It's also a word most people learned thanks to the fictional Malcolm Tucker character in The Thick of It (Season 3, episode 6 when he's yelling at Ben Swain)
Re:The strange case of Britain’s demise by narcindin on Saturday December 17, 2022 @08:33PM (#34034196)
Probably [facile](https://www.thefreedictionary.com/facile), here meaning superficial, reductive, or weak.

Edit: Actually probably what the UK ppl are saying

Re:The strange case of Britain’s demise by tobylane on Sunday December 18, 2022 @10:42AM (#34038694)
I reject the idea that I'm burying my head in the sand, if that's your reaction to my post. I'm wary of expanding on it on HN. The short version is that there were genuine policy reasons to dislike him (even from a POV left of Blair), overwhelmed by the media and the Labour party disinformation. https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-62226042

Do you know who the article is saying should try harder?