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Re:Americans are choosing to be alone, but we should reverse... by foobarian on Saturday November 26, 2022 @07:23PM (#33758582)
As kid I spent time in an old fashioned Russian serf type village, where a bunch of families lived together and worked a bunch of strips of land. It was the best time I ever had. Everyone had a job to do, and they were happy to let you help. The tasks you were given seemed fulfilling and meaningful.

Today is horrible. Nobody lives with family or knows neighbors around here. No more church. There are some craft clubs, but what's the point? Anything you can make pales in comparison to what you can get for a couple of bucks from Amazon. Growing a garden also seems pointless when you see the local grocery store. There are a bunch of hobbies but they also seem pointless when you look at a few Youtube videos and see all the popular channels doing exactly what you would like to but a million times better.

Honestly if I didn't have a kid I'd probably hang up my hat, but I do need to figure out how to make sure the kid doesn't have this experience.

(p.s. moving back to the Russian serf village is not the solution, that place is now ruined, young people moved to the city, old people died off or drank themselves to death. One guy hung himself.)

Re:Americans are choosing to be alone, but we should reverse... by UnpossibleJim on Saturday November 26, 2022 @07:54PM (#33758815)
If you can find a community garden, they're way better than the grocery. No offense or anything. Plus you get to meet your local community. I miss mine, now that I'm in the suburbs.

You might look into it. It fosters a lot more than just healthy food. It builds neighborhoods, reclaims land and makes friends in the community. They're great.

Re:Americans are choosing to be alone, but we should reverse... by bergenty on Saturday November 26, 2022 @09:13PM (#33759396)
All of these suggestions are optional. The biggest part of community is it is a forced coexistence. Anything optional takes willpower and most people just will not do consistently.
Re:Americans are choosing to be alone, but we should reverse... by watwut on Sunday November 27, 2022 @05:24AM (#33761890)
Optional community is strictly superior to forced one. Cause you can get away if it becomes abusive.
Re:Americans are choosing to be alone, but we should reverse... by bergenty on Sunday November 27, 2022 @12:25PM (#33764668)
For a small proportion of abused people. It usually works very well for 95%+ of the people in it. It’s definitely not worth throwing it in the trash for those kinds of numbers.
Re:Americans are choosing to be alone, but we should reverse... by toxicFork on Saturday November 26, 2022 @08:49PM (#33759224)
Why do you want to compare everything you do to what others are doing?

Allow yourself to do things that others do better.

You do not have to be the best.

You will enjoy life much more. Your kids will, too.

Re:Americans are choosing to be alone, but we should reverse... by prawn on Saturday November 26, 2022 @10:58PM (#33760177)
Further, your kids seeing you do these things will think you are the best at it or will be enthralled trying to emulate superior efforts with you. I can't paint. My painting efforts are embarrassing. My daughter, keen on painting, saw my horrific effort today and thought it was amazing. If we watched an artist on YouTube and then tried to paint together, she would absolutely enjoy that too.

If you don't have an internal appreciation of simple crafts (gardening, making something) then your children can help you find purpose in it.

Re:Americans are choosing to be alone, but we should reverse... by nradov on Saturday November 26, 2022 @10:31PM (#33759979)
Your memories of that Russian serf village are distorted and incomplete. Most subsistence farming work is far from being happy and fulfilling. Talk to adults who spent decades living that way. They might not have been lonely, but their lives were bleak in most other ways. Why do you think so many left as soon as they could? Why did those who remained turn into alcoholics?

Today is great.

Re:Americans are choosing to be alone, but we should reverse... by Nomentatus on Sunday November 27, 2022 @12:12AM (#33760600)
Marx was wrong about some big things (innovation, depressions) and right about some big things - alienation, meaning destruction of community.
Re:Americans are choosing to be alone, but we should reverse... by NegativeK on Sunday November 27, 2022 @12:46AM (#33760729)
> There are some craft clubs, but what's the point? Anything you can make pales in comparison to what you can get for a couple of bucks from Amazon.

This is unhealthy.

> There are a bunch of hobbies but they also seem pointless when you look at a few Youtube videos and see all the popular channels doing exactly what you would like to but a million times better.

This is unhealthy.

Over a decade ago, I had to accept that I'll never be the best at anything or even better than huge swaths of people in my line of work or in my hobby, and that's perfectly okay. There's only one best in the world. Most people who play basketball will never ever come close to the NBA. Setting out with failure in mind (even when you're not in pursuit of perfection) is great. Pointless, dumb play is amazing.

When I was a kid, I didn't compare my Lego play time with others. Or the time I spent riding my bike down a hill and jumping off it onto the grass to professional stunt performers.

The end product isn't what you walk away with; it's the time you spend enjoying doing something.

(On the flip side, pick the project. You don't need to compost to plant a garden, and you don't need to learn how to shave sheep or spin yarn to learn knitting.)

Re:Americans are choosing to be alone, but we should reverse... by MuffinFlavored on Sunday November 27, 2022 @01:36AM (#33760926)
> This is unhealthy.

And? How does one magically snap their fingers and change their hard-to-control brain? OP has a point in everything they're saying. Calling it unhealthy doesn't magically fix (inverse) their (very real/probably populous) perspective.

Re:Americans are choosing to be alone, but we should reverse... by karpierz on Sunday November 27, 2022 @04:53AM (#33761755)
> How does one magically snap their fingers and change their hard-to-control brain?

There is no magic solution. But recognizing that there is a problem, it can be solved, and deciding to put effort into solving it are what it takes to fix it. This is step one.

Re:Americans are choosing to be alone, but we should reverse... by tbran on Sunday November 27, 2022 @09:01AM (#33762970)
Turn off YouTube and go do something.

Very simple, very effective.

Re:Americans are choosing to be alone, but we should reverse... by NegativeK on Sunday November 27, 2022 @07:59PM (#33768647)
Stop consuming that media.

Most mainstream (I use that term loosely; the internet has made a lot of things very accessible) hobbies have a lot of content producers. Some of them only make gorgeous things with expensive tools. There's always some producers who are more educational and show their mistakes and thought process.

I know "stop consuming addictive media" isn't trivially easy, but you get the added benefit of avoiding content that isn't as educationally beneficial.

Re:Americans are choosing to be alone, but we should reverse... by kuramitropolis on Sunday November 27, 2022 @01:57AM (#33761022)
>The end product isn't what you walk away with; it's the time you spend enjoying doing something.

Well, good luck enjoying anything when you're surrounded by environmental feedback that points to its futility.

Picking up hobbies so that you have a socially acceptable excuse to interact with to people is ass-backwards.

Re:Americans are choosing to be alone, but we should reverse... by zamfi on Sunday November 27, 2022 @02:46AM (#33761237)
> Well, good luck enjoying anything when you're surrounded by environmental feedback that points to its futility.

You're only surrounded by this feedback if you already buy in to the ideology that if you're not The Best™ at something then it's not worth doing.

This is a very toxic perspective.

The millions of people who learn to program/woodwork/paint/cook/etc. by watching YouTube videos certainly don't buy into this ideology, and have no problem enjoying it. I think the issue less "environment feedback that points to futility" and more your own perspective here.

People have hobbies for many reasons, "socially acceptable excuse to interact with people" is just one of them, as is "demonstrate exceptional mastery".

Re:Americans are choosing to be alone, but we should reverse... by watwut on Sunday November 27, 2022 @05:11AM (#33761829)
> Picking up hobbies so that you have a socially acceptable excuse to interact with to people is ass-backwards.

It is and WAS most normal thing in the world. Some people did it subconsciously, them being interested I people lead them to be interested in the same things as those people are interested in. Others did it consciously "everyone seems to gather at pool, let's go to pool". Or just, "I am going to bake a cake to have excuse to give it to people and to get compliments".

Doing things and hobbies to be with others, to impress them was normal human behavior for millenia.

Re:Americans are choosing to be alone, but we should reverse... by adwn on Sunday November 27, 2022 @07:32AM (#33762530)
> moving back to the Russian serf village is not the solution, that place is now ruined, young people moved to the city, old people died off or drank themselves to death. One guy hung himself.

Is it possible that you have a distorted perception or memory of life in that village? If it was such a happy place, why did so many young people move away, why did old people drink so much, and why did one person commit suicide?

Re:Americans are choosing to be alone, but we should reverse... by nadieyninguno1 on Sunday November 27, 2022 @08:35AM (#33762826)
The same reason small towns all over the world are - times have changed, and drastically.

Folks have to leave in search of work, the old ways aren’t possible thanks to our smaller, more efficient world.

The brain-drain kills off the village and what’s left is a rotting corpse of what once was. Or at least the corpses from those deaths of despair.

Re:Americans are choosing to be alone, but we should reverse... by everybodyknows on Sunday November 27, 2022 @09:31AM (#33763156)
> Growing a garden also seems pointless when you see the local grocery store.

Maybe a greenhouse would be needed, but you can grow backyard produce of much higher quality than is typical in grocery stores. Then offer it your neighbors. Some will show gratitude. Those are the ones to try to make friends of.