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Re:Bumble open sources Private Detector, AI tool to detect u... by Kiro on Tuesday October 25, 2022 @02:59AM (#33327128)
Sending unsolicited nudes is a crime so no, it should not be allowed even if there are people who enjoy that stuff.
Re:Bumble open sources Private Detector, AI tool to detect u... by danuker on Tuesday October 25, 2022 @03:25AM (#33327277)
It is not.

https://www.marieclaire.com/politics/bumble-now-unsolicited-...

> This sending of unsolicited nudes, or cyberflashing, is not only violent and pernicious, it’s entirely without consequences in 49 states.

Re:Bumble open sources Private Detector, AI tool to detect u... by Kiro on Tuesday October 25, 2022 @03:36AM (#33327351)
Keep reading the article and you will see it is now indeed illegal in a few places, including Texas where Bumble is based.

> Now, the sending of a lewd photo without the recipient’s consent is a Class C misdemeanor in Texas, punishable by a fine of up to $500.

Re:Bumble open sources Private Detector, AI tool to detect u... by zimpenfish on Tuesday October 25, 2022 @05:18AM (#33328143)
> you will see it is now indeed illegal in a few places

There's a bill waiting for a Governor's signature in Virginia (which I guess will make it illegal there) and some bills being discussed / worked on in other places but as far as I can tell from the article, Texas is currently the only state with an actual law on the books to make it illegal.

Re:Bumble open sources Private Detector, AI tool to detect u... by 4gotunameagain on Tuesday October 25, 2022 @05:11AM (#33328077)
> not only violent

When the western world is so isolated from violence that a naked photo is labeled as such..

Don't get me wrong, that is probably a good thing. And of course I am against unsolicited nudes, but "violence" is a bit of a stretch

Re:Bumble open sources Private Detector, AI tool to detect u... by mschuster91 on Tuesday October 25, 2022 @05:38AM (#33328299)
There are jurisdictions other than the US, you know? Germany, for example, places unsolicited nude photos as a felony [1].

[1] https://www.anwalt.de/rechtstipps/strafanzeige-wegen-des-ver...

Re:Bumble open sources Private Detector, AI tool to detect u... by formerly_proven on Tuesday October 25, 2022 @07:48AM (#33329248)
184 isn't a highlight of German legislation though. It's one of the many leftovers from the prussian police and justice system, which had a heavy emphasis on morality and decency. 184 for example also criminalizes everyone in Germany who ever uploaded porn to a site that doesn't comply with current youth protection laws (which is all of them, basically).
Re:Bumble open sources Private Detector, AI tool to detect u... by mschuster91 on Tuesday October 25, 2022 @08:11AM (#33329432)
Fully agree that the 184 series of StGB is not up to date (e.g. that 17 year olds routinely end up in trouble with the law for sending their partners consensual pictures) and the German youth protection law is ridiculous, but the idea that sending someone unsolicited pornography is bad is a good one IMHO.
Re:Bumble open sources Private Detector, AI tool to detect u... by formerly_proven on Tuesday October 25, 2022 @09:15AM (#33330045)
Sure, nothing wrong per se with 184(1)6 criminalizing that.

I'd argue though that this only comes about unintentionally because 184i (sexual harassment) only covers physical sexual harassment.

Meanwhile non-physical sexual harassment is completely legal in Germany unless it is an insult in itself (185).

IMHO the proper way is to mostly yeet 184 (because there is no particular reason for the state to morally regulate porn using the criminal code apart from stuff like CSAM) and criminalize sexual harassment in general (physical or not). That's of course going to be a hard sell for German conservatives (I can already see CDU and AfD go "the leftist greens dictatorship is making DATING illegal!")

Re:Bumble open sources Private Detector, AI tool to detect u... by DarkWiiPlayer on Tuesday October 25, 2022 @09:36AM (#33330276)
Honestly, I think the proper way with most laws would be to just yeet them entirely and go for a round of refactoring; but alas, politicians aren't programmers and neither do they have the same mindset of cleaning up after themselves or even after others, so we're stuck with sub-optimal legislation like this and that probably won't ever change.
Re:Bumble open sources Private Detector, AI tool to detect u... by mschuster91 on Tuesday October 25, 2022 @09:45AM (#33330367)
It has happened a couple of times in the past (e.g. with the law on transgender people or homosexual marriage) that the courts stepped in and demanded improvement or yeeted laws outright as they became untenable.

It's not unthinkable, particularly as the generation "18th birthday gift? Onlyfans account" enters political life, that the same will happen again. Additionally, the youth protection commission NRW is on a holy crusade against Pornhub and other sites - should they eventually be successful, younger people who don't care about the news and only react when they see their favourite porn site going dark in Germany may rise up and demand reforms as well.

And on top of that, boomers are thankfully slowly dying out and retiring, so the gerontocrats in parliament will go away as well.

Re:Bumble open sources Private Detector, AI tool to detect u... by AlmostAnyone on Tuesday October 25, 2022 @03:06AM (#33327172)
How does your model differentiate solicited and unsolicited nudes?
Re:Bumble open sources Private Detector, AI tool to detect u... by zimpenfish on Tuesday October 25, 2022 @05:19AM (#33328157)
Doesn't need to, does it? If it's solicited, you know to click on the blurred image. No harm done.
Re:Bumble open sources Private Detector, AI tool to detect u... by AlmostAnyone on Tuesday October 25, 2022 @06:14AM (#33328520)
The person I replied to said sending nudes shouldn't be allowed at all
Re:Bumble open sources Private Detector, AI tool to detect u... by jasonlotito on Tuesday October 25, 2022 @09:36AM (#33330280)
They did not say sending nudes shouldn't be allowed. They send sending unsolicited nudes should not be allowed at all, even if a few people enjoy it.

They aren't saying people can be naked in front of other people, but that flashing people shouldn't be allowed.

Re:Bumble open sources Private Detector, AI tool to detect u... by benj111 on Tuesday October 25, 2022 @08:27AM (#33329573)
At what point does a nude become unsolicited though? I mean this is a dating site.

If I put my arm around someone or lean in for a kiss that could be unsolicited but shouldn't be illegal in the context of a date. Similarly dirty talking in a date is different to doing it in the office.

I suppose this could be dealt with through user preferences (don't show nudes/ doesn't appreciate nudes) but the line seems blurred in this situation. It isn't as if you're walking around town in a Mac.

I'm not saying it's ok, but it's not definitely, not ok. People are different, dating is already hard enough without worrying about if you're going to be arrested for trying to get to second base.

Re:Bumble open sources Private Detector, AI tool to detect u... by DarkWiiPlayer on Tuesday October 25, 2022 @09:41AM (#33330333)
It's honestly baffling that I have to explain this, but: Expressing interest in finding someone to date does not imply any form of consent to being sent nudes.

Some people might want that, and for them it would make sense if platforms added an opt-in feature to signal their interest in unsolicited nudes, or to opt-out of whatever form of filtering there might be.

But the default should be that you can open an app for meeting people without being forced to see someone's dick.

Re:Bumble open sources Private Detector, AI tool to detect u... by benj111 on Tuesday October 25, 2022 @10:24AM (#33330854)
Well I've already covered the second two paragraphs.

And I didn't claim the first paragraph was the case.

But I can see a flirty conversation getting to a point where sending a nude might be reasonable to one party. Just like putting a hand on someone's inner thigh might be reasonable to one party at a certain point in a date. It may not be appreciated, signs might have been misread, but unless you want people to sign contracts before they go to bed with each other there's always the danger of there being misunderstandings. And in my view misunderstandings shouldn't be criminalised.

My girlfriend might not appreciate me sending her nudes. I hope we can agree that's different to flashing at random people on the street.

My point is there's nuance. This isn't a black and white issue, certainly in the context of a dating app.

Re:Bumble open sources Private Detector, AI tool to detect u... by ilikecakeandpie on Tuesday October 25, 2022 @10:35AM (#33331005)
It is always unsolicited until it is reasonably, directly solicited
Re:Bumble open sources Private Detector, AI tool to detect u... by benj111 on Tuesday October 25, 2022 @11:58AM (#33332354)
Right but then you're making 'reasonably' and 'directly' do a lot of heavy lifting.

And what does directly even mean in this context? The standards for initiating sex don't require a sit down conversation as to what each party is agreeing to. So why should nude sending be held to a different standard?

Re:Bumble open sources Private Detector, AI tool to detect u... by Kiro on Tuesday October 25, 2022 @04:33PM (#33335772)
In modern countries that have implemented a consent-based model instead of a coercion-based one you can't just initiate sex with someone based on your presumption that the other person wants it. If they actually don't (even if they don't explicitly say "no") it's considered rape by the law.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sexual_consent_in_law

Re:Bumble open sources Private Detector, AI tool to detect u... by benj111 on Wednesday October 26, 2022 @03:57AM (#33340991)
And in what consent based jurisdictions are you required to sit down and have a conversation about what is going to happen?
Re:Bumble open sources Private Detector, AI tool to detect u... by Kiro on Wednesday October 26, 2022 @09:26AM (#33343346)
All of them if you want to be sure, which you should. Update your obsolete and outdated view on consent.
Re:Bumble open sources Private Detector, AI tool to detect u... by benj111 on Wednesday October 26, 2022 @09:58AM (#33343792)
Should I also breathalyse my girlfriend if she gets drunk and horny?

She tells me off if I suggest going to bed to have sex because it kills the mood. So what? Am I to give up sex because our views on consent don't match up with your views?

Have you ever actually been in a relationship? Or do you just have an aversion to sponteniety?

Re:Bumble open sources Private Detector, AI tool to detect u... by Kiro on Thursday October 27, 2022 @03:12AM (#33354235)
Wow, disgusting comment. I have no interest in discussing this with a rape apologist. Good bye and I hope you come to realize how ancient your views on equality are.
Re:Bumble open sources Private Detector, AI tool to detect u... by ilikecakeandpie on Wednesday October 26, 2022 @04:55PM (#33349307)
The context for this is talking to a person on a dating app where you haven't met them personally. In that case, assuming you've never met them, I think it's inappropriate to send an explicit photo/video unless they straight up ask to see it.

"The standards for initiating sex don't require a sit down conversation as to what each party is agreeing to."

This attitude leads to women having sex/relations they aren't super comfortable doing. It's not a mood killer if you take a beat just to make sure you're on the same page with expectations and it takes a lot less time than locating, opening, and putting on a condom.

You stated in a different comment that your gf tells you off and it kills the mood if you ask to move to the bedroom or having sex while impaired, but surely you realize that's a totally different situation than you meeting up with someone from a dating app, right? Spontaneously acting with someone you know and with who you have built trust is waaaaaay different than sending an unsolicited nude or making advances on someone who is a little more than a stranger.